UN (again!)

Advertisement

Viewed 2026 times

    zound posted Tue, 23 Apr 2013 23:12:40 GMT(4/23/2013)

    Post 1 of 656
    Joined 4/21/2013

    Hi guys, I'm new to the site.

    Sorry to bring up an old topic. But just wondering if anyone knew if the brochure referred to in the infamous UN letter of 2004 is available to read anywhere?

    This is the brochure of 1991 (before the supposed "changed language that we cannot subsribe to")

    Also, the Watchtower claim in writing that they never had to sign anything - is this just an outright lie?

    zound posted Tue, 23 Apr 2013 23:14:27 GMT(4/23/2013)

    Post 2 of 656
    Joined 4/21/2013

    Oops, I put this in the wrong section. If a moderator wants to move it that would be great.

    Newly Enlightened posted Tue, 23 Apr 2013 23:46:40 GMT(4/23/2013)

    Post 392 of 958
    Joined 11/14/2012

    Welcome Zound. Glad to have you here with us. There is quite a bit of info on the website below.

    I'm not sure if it has the info you seek on the UN & WTBT$

    http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/united-nations-association.php

    mind blown posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 00:09:27 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 1253 of 1541
    Joined 3/29/2010

    Hello Zound,

    Also, here's a "wealth" of information/links Lady Lee posted on one convenient thread from JWN regarding the UN debacle. There's also debates there which debunk any excuse.

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/best-of/76847/1/The-Best-of-WTS-and-the-UN

    zound posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 00:26:57 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 3 of 656
    Joined 4/21/2013

    Thanks guys.

    I've searched JWfacts but couldn't find that brochure.

    Also, lots of those links in the best of don't work. I did find the answer to them not having to sign anything - which is probably true as the application form I looked at didn't have a signiture part.

    But still looking for that grochure.

    F Lady Lee posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 01:20:04 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 17076 of 14228
    Joined 6/29/2001

    I moved it for you.

    Thanks for putting up the link.

    To actually get to the threads you need to copy and paste the title of the thread and do a Google search.

    I don't know that it was a brochure. I think it was an Awake that praised the UN to show its "support" and therefore fulfill its part of the UN agreement. That Awake is probably listed in those files

    a quote:

    "… the appropriate role for the Vatican is that of a NGO—the same as all the other NGOs representing Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Bahais and other religious organisations." -UN official . --From an article in the November 22 nd , 2000, Awake, dealing with the movement to remove the Vatican from its UN seat. The WBTS were also an NGO at this stage…

    Preparation for NGO Status

    Before being accepted for NGO status the Society, in common with other applicants, had to demonstrate their commitment and ability to work with the UN and they had to submit at least six examples of how they were promoting the UN’s activities (highlighted on next page). Various articles in the Watchtower and Awake, which highlighted the work of the United Nations, fulfilled this requirement.

    -------------------------

    Fulfilling obligations to the UN

    In addition to the requirements via their application, having acquired NGO status it was necessary to send the DPI proof that they were informing the public about the UN’s many programs. It is reasonable to suggest that the Society wrote articles for that very purpose. Indeed had they not wilfully produced such material they could not have maintained NGO status. Nothing else can explain the appearance of articles that appeared in their publications presenting the UN in a positive light. As an example, the November 22, 1998, Awake! Magazine was devoted to praising the UN’s Declaration of Human Rights on the 50 th anniversary of its signing. The UN were so taken with that article it listed that particular Awake on its website.

    ----------------------------------

    Scott77 posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 01:26:53 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 3120 of 3429
    Joined 4/3/2009

    Preparation for NGO Status

    Before being accepted for NGO status the Society, in common with other applicants, had to demonstrate their commitment and ability to work with the UN and they had to submit at least six examples of how they were promoting the UN’s activities (highlighted on next page). Various articles in the Watchtower and Awake, which highlighted the work of the United Nations, fulfilled this requirement.

    -------------------------

    Fulfilling obligations to the UN

    In addition to the requirements via their application, having acquired NGO status it was necessary to send the DPI proof that they were informing the public about the UN’s many programs. It is reasonable to suggest that the Society wrote articles for that very purpose. Indeed had they not wilfully produced such material they could not have maintained NGO status. Nothing else can explain the appearance of articles that appeared in their publications presenting the UN in a positive light. As an example, the November 22, 1998, Awake! Magazine was devoted to praising the UN’s Declaration of Human Rights on the 50 th anniversary of its signing. The UN were so taken with that article it listed that particular Awake on its website.

    Lady Lee,

    Thanks for the updates. Please, can someone with inside knowledge of the working of the United Nation order the UN to release everything documents submitted by the Watchtower in their application for UN membership?

    Scott77

    mind blown posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:18:09 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 1255 of 1541
    Joined 3/29/2010

    Is this what you're looking for?

    This letter issued by the WTS states the UN changed rules to use their Library in 1991:

    .....

    Scott77 posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:26:01 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 3121 of 3429
    Joined 4/3/2009

    Thanks mind blown. Now we need the actual copy of application form, what was filed in, who signed, supporting documentations, etc .

    Scott77

    zound posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:29:49 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 4 of 656
    Joined 4/21/2013

    Thanks for the replies, good info. Not the exact thing I was after though (it may not be available, just thought I'd ask you guys)

    Below is a quote from the standard public letter from the UN on inquiry:

    "Please be informed that it is the policy of of DPI to keep correspndance between NGO's confidential...... However please see paragraph included in all letters sent to NGO's approved for association in 1992:

    'The blablablablaba......... We are enclosing a brochure on the "The United Nations and Non-Governmental Organizations" , which will give you some information regarding the NGO relationship.'"

    So they sent the Watchtower Society a Brochure that goes into more detail about NGO status. I've seen some exerts of more recent brochures that are sent to NGO's, but not one circa 1991. Which the Watchtower society claims by inference that it 'contained no language that they could not adhere to'.

    The excerts I read of the newer versions of course DO say about supporting the charter etc. I'd be interested to track down that brochure that was sent out during 1991-1992.

    mind blown posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:30:25 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 1256 of 1541
    Joined 3/29/2010

    If you scroll down on this link this letter from the UN states the NGO has not changed since 1991.....Plus, one does not have to be a member of NGO to use the UN Library...

    scroll down the link and you'll find it.

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/scandals/222903/2/Watchtowers-United-Nations-Association

    I'm pretty sure I have what you talking about........I'll search more tomorrow.....I have to head out right now......

    zound posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:40:20 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 6 of 656
    Joined 4/21/2013

    Mindblown, that second letter is good - "#3 that the criteria has not changed since 1991."

    It looks like it is addressed to a personal inquiry not a public letter that can be found on their website. Thus it could be a 'fake', concocted by apostates and thus would be discredited by the JWs I'm trying to present this info to. I've tried writing to the UN, but only got the standard public letter so far. I think I either need that info in a public letter or a letter addressed to me if it will float with the JW's.

    Which is why I'm trying to track down that brochure as I'm sure it would be incriminating.

    mind blown posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 02:42:02 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 1257 of 1541
    Joined 3/29/2010

    In the mean time go through this entire link......we really hammer out ALL the issues.....

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/scandals/222903/1/Watchtowers-United-Nations-Association

    I'll drop back in tomorrow.....

    LoisLane looking for Superman posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 04:03:46 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 854 of 2858
    Joined 8/19/2012

    The ending...The usual...

    Please be assured of our Warm Christian Love and "BEST WISHES?" What is this?

    Am I just tired tonight? I don't ever recall "BEST WISHES", on any of The Society's correspondence.

    What category do they slot BEST WISHES?

    We wish upon a star. lol

    We wish we wouldn't grow old and die, like you promised. lol

    Who is listening to these "Good WISHES"?

    That's what I would like to know.

    Of course, there is no Good Luck, but saying "Best Wishes"... in a letter from the Governing Body?

    I am washing JW doctrines/nonsense out of my head.

    Maybe I am just being picky this evening?

    Just Lois

    >>>>>Zound>>>>> Round - Sound - Pound - Bound - Found - Mound - Wound...Welcome! I hope you stay around on this mound of Truth, because you are bound to find plenty of people who have wound down, in their desire to be a WT Drone, in fact, they have found, they want to pound the alarm...like you, and want to share TTATT, The Truth About The Truth. We hope to hear, here, many, much and more, from you. lol

    Just Lois saying nite - nite from The North Pacific

    BroMac posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 09:59:51 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 615 of 725
    Joined 10/13/2011

    It is still available on UN.org

    Top right Search box: "watchtower pdf"

    http://search.un.org/search?q=watchtower+pdf&btnG=Search+UN+Website&output=xml_no_dtd&client=UN_Website_en&proxystylesheet=UN_Website_en&oe=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&adv=true&lr=lang_en&num=10&sort=score&Submit2=Search&ud=1&exclude_apps=1&site=

    PDF:

    http://search.un.org/smb/secf10.un.org/DigiLib/$/DigitalLibrary/Dig/www.un.org/dpi/ngosection/pdfs/watchtower.pdf

    Splash posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 13:11:15 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 612 of 1674
    Joined 7/16/2012

    The letter above from WT to the branch offices says:

    "Still, the Criteria for Association of NGO's - at least in their latest version - contains language that we cannot subscribe to."

    This does not say that the language changed, only that in the latest version they decided they could no longer subscribe to it. The latest version could have been in existence since prior to 1991, which is just what the UN themselves claim to be the case.

    It is worded in such a way as to make the reader think there was a change to the Terms of Association.

    Splash

    DATA-DOG posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 14:22:28 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 1893 of 6409
    Joined 6/21/2012

    I like JWOP's page. Here you go. http://witness-outreach.com/UN.html

    Incognito posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 14:27:02 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 151 of 220
    Joined 2/14/2004

    Zound said:

    Thus it could be a 'fake', concocted by apostates and thus would be discredited by the JWs I'm trying to present this info to.

    and

    Which is why I'm trying to track down that brochure as I'm sure it would be incriminating.

    Even if you had possession of the printed brochure directly from the UN, many JWs would discredit the info and say that it had been either made by or was altered by apostates.

    Although I wish you success in trying to make a point to the JWs you're trying to reach, I honestly expect that you'll end-up frustrated and criticised for making an attempt, especially if you're trying to back-out and fade

    Most JWs refuse to listen to or view anything critical of their beloved WT Society regardless of the factualness of the information. JWs will rationalize and justify anything the Society say or do, even when in direct contradiction to Bible principles or even to what the WT has stated themselves.

    Rufus T. Firefly posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 15:29:51 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 13 of 94
    Joined 4/18/2013

    The fact is that the WTS has never publicly addressed the issue of registering with the UN in violation of its own published policy; therefore, the "old topic" remains very relevant. By its own standard of judging other religions, the WTS itself stands condemned as an apostate organization.

    The World Headquarters letter to its Branch Committee suggests a very flimsy excuse the very purpose of which was to deflect sincere questions by devout JWs who thoroughly understood the WTS's policy concerning such affiliations. One cannot help but wonder who posted the confidential memo on the Internet. Whoever it was performed a great service in doing so.

    Splash posted Wed, 24 Apr 2013 16:59:31 GMT(4/24/2013)

    Post 613 of 1674
    Joined 7/16/2012

    @DATA-DOG
    Thanks for the link, I'd not seen that one before!

    Splash

      Close

      Confirm ...