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Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
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Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Wed, 06 Oct 2010 22:02:00 GMT
(10/6/2010)
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Post 819 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
I've been reading the trial transcript and I found this little nugget (page 1028). This comes while the prosecution is questioning Rutherford: Q. That being your view of it - that a man who was consecrated must not engage in war, then, that is your idea, that you are opposed to all war?
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thetrueone
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Wed, 06 Oct 2010 22:18:00 GMT
(10/6/2010)
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![]() British ColumbiaPost 2117 of 6138 Since 9/18/2006 |
Another tidbit of info. supporting the fact that Rutherford was a power seeking opportunist trying whatever means he could find to establish this wanted desire and really what better way to achieve this than to become a President of a religiously Incorporated publishing house, even though it was built upon bullshit, ignorance and fear. Yep, you could see him gloating with self pride driving down the road in his Cadillac, he did good for himself, he really made it
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Wed, 06 Oct 2010 23:02:00 GMT
(10/6/2010)
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Post 508 of 1606 Since 12/31/2009 |
Good find! Another example of neutrality perverted by theocratic warfare? |
jwfacts
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Wed, 06 Oct 2010 23:05:00 GMT
(10/6/2010)
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![]() New South WalesPost 5448 of 7384 Since 6/25/2005 |
interesting find. Do you have a link to the transcript?
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 00:31:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 821 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 00:35:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Post 15227 of 17777 Since 9/1/2002 |
That's a mighty nice find. Very telling about Rutherford's motives and ambitions. BTW, it is on p. 993, not p. 1028.
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JimmyPage
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 00:37:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Post 2683 of 3146 Since 3/9/2008 |
Nice catch. Amazing how one asshole can ruin generations of lives. |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 00:38:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 822 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
Sorry, 1028 of the PDF file from the link I posted. |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 00:47:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Post 15228 of 17777 Since 9/1/2002 |
I think Rutherford got his army.
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 01:22:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 823 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
want to read about why Rutherford, in his own words, kicked out the 4 opposers when he took over? Read pages 1033 to 1039 (of the PDF, not the transcript page numbers). |
slimboyfat
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 02:46:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Afghanistan Post 4160 of 7518 Since 11/24/2004 |
He seems to be wishing to emphasize how becoming a Christian had changed his outlook. |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 13:19:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 402 of 798 Since 4/26/2009 |
Interesting find. This squares with another things such as how Rutheford began to rebrand the Organization with military designations. For instance congregations became "companies" (as in military units).
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snowbird
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 13:37:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() AlabamaPost 20070 of 26277 Since 5/2/2007 |
Meetings for field service were called a rendezvous. From Free Online Dictionary: ren·dez·vous
(rän n.pl.ren·dez·vous(-v z )1. A meeting at a prearranged time and place. See Synonyms at engagement. 2. A prearranged meeting place, especially an assembly point for troops or ships. 3. A popular gathering place: The café is a favorite rendezvous for artists. 4. Aerospace The process of bringing two spacecraft together. ____________________________________________________ |
LongHairGal
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 14:53:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 2248 of 3465 Since 3/11/2005 |
MYTHBUSTER, We should never underestimate the capacity of a very driven man who is hell-bent on domination. When I read things like this I am ashamed and angry at myself for the time I wasted in this sham. Too bad there was no internet for research when I came in. I couldn't find any library books about the religion either. |
Mary
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 14:57:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Post 12287 of 13605 Since 6/26/2002 |
Nice catch. Amazing how one asshole can ruin generations of lives. Ya, but those are overlapping generations, so it's really just one generation that the asshole ruined. |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 15:01:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 181 of 259 Since 9/7/2010 |
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thetrueone
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 15:32:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() British ColumbiaPost 2126 of 6138 Since 9/18/2006 |
If there was anything good about the man at least he pursued the resistance to bare arms. Of course there are other Christian based faiths that do so as well. Maybe it was the power of WTS. publishing Corporation that eventually drew to his calculable corruption ? The gospel end times was really a marketing scheme for the publishing company from the very beginning .
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 23:14:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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![]() Post 3496 of 4414 Since 7/7/2004 |
Mythbuster - can you PLEASE just cut and paste why he kicked the 4 opposers out? I cannot get it to download. HB |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Thu, 07 Oct 2010 23:40:00 GMT
(10/7/2010)
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Post 825 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
I can but the PDF text doesn't copy over as plain text. It would take a while to do it. The PDF file is HUGE, 150+ MB. Are you giving it enough time to download?
I'll see what I can do. |
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Re: Rutherford admits why he stole control of WTB&TS
posted Fri, 08 Oct 2010 01:57:00 GMT
(10/8/2010)
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Post 828 of 1016 Since 11/26/2009 |
This is Rutherford being cross-examined by prosecution attorney Oeland. But all the lawyers and Judge jump in and out of it. Q. On the 17th of July you had quite a celebration there or as one of the witnesses put it, a gala event? Q. Were Mr. Woodworth and Mr. Fisher invited to be present? Q. Were they invited to be present? Q. Who else was invited? Q. Was that the day set for the celebration of the beginning of the distribution of the seventh mystery? Q. From where? Q. None from Brooklyn? Q. Wasn't that the day set, you had a lot on hand? Q. You knew they were shipped before? Q. You had them there? Q. On that day you removed four directors? The Court: They were physically there? Q. Didn't you issue an order they were removed and other people appointed in their place? Q. Four other men had been acting as directors up to the time you appointed these other four men? Q. You announced that they were removed and others had been appointed in their place? Q. They had been acting up to that time, these four directors? Q. When were you elected a director? Q. When were you elected before that time? Q. I'm not asking legally or illegally. Q. One or two of these men had been on the board prior to your time? Q. One of these men, Mr. Hirsch, had been elected by the board at which you presided? Q. After you elected him, January, 1917? Q. He kept acting? Q. I did not ask you about upsetting the society. Q. We will get a little straighter later on. You were acting as a director? Q. Mr. Hirsh was elected a director by the board in which you presided in January, 19171 Q. He acted up until July 17th, 1917? Q. Mr. Ritchie, was he a director, too? Q. How long had he been acting as such? Q. More than that, didn't he? Q. There was Hirsch elected by the board in January, at which you presided? Q. Mr. Ritchie had been a member, acting as a member of the Board of Directors, how long? Q. Who else? Q. How long was Mr. Wright acting? Q. How long before? Q. You sat with him in board meetings after you became the presiding officer of the board? Q. Who else? Q. How long had he been holding office? Q. Acting as such? Q, And your charter provided directors should hold the position for life? Q. Didn't your charter provide your directors should hold office during life unless removed by a two-third vote? Q. Is that a part of it? Q. You had been holding as a director under that charter? Q. Since 1911 ? Q. You came in after some of these men were put on the Board of Directors? Q. And yet on July 17th, you removed these four and appointed another four? Q. They had been acting there? Q. How long had Mr. Van Amburgh been acting in that capacity? Q. In the same way? Q. As a director? Q. Who else, you? Q. You were elected director, holding as officer? Q. Was Mr. Pierson an officer? Q. Wasn't Mr. Ritchie the vice president before that? Q. You removed him and put in Pierson? Q. Doesn't your charter provide officers shall be elected by the shareholders? Q. Then you have these four men acting as directors, one of them elected by the board at which you presided, and you know the law to be that directors hold over until subsequent election in the event- Q. Where did you get your improper election from? Q. Who else was elected? Q. You were elected not a director, you were elected president? Q. And Mr. Van Amburgh was elected secretary and treasurer? Q. And you removed four acting directors? Q. Did you say you are out and I am going to put four other men? Q. Did you declare the office vacant on the 17th of July? Q. When did you make the vacancy, exact? Q. You made it the 12th. You declared these men were not there and there was a vacancy? Q. You put in and had a meeting with your four new directors on the 17th? Q. And from the 17th the money was paid out of The Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society for the publication of "The Finished Mystery"? Q. You have answered yes. Q. Is it true the money was paid out of the Watch Tower? Q. It is true after the l7th the money was paid out of The Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, after exhausting the $5,000? Q. Is it true after July 17th-prior to July 17th not a dollar was paid out of the funds of The Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society? Mr. Sparks: I will ask you those questions. The Court: You have this one answered. To put off the explanation, which is the practice in a good many courts, I have always thought it loses its effectiveness. I think we will take the course, as on other occasions here, and if the witness desires to make an explanation he may do it, rather than to put it off until after; it would lose its effectiveness. Q. Will you explain, Mr. Rutherford? The Court: That wouldn't have anything to do here. The Witness?: Yes,he came here and started the same thing here with these men. The Court: What he did in london was of no concern. The Witness: It was our concern; we have a London office. He tied up alll the funds in London. I cabled our solicitor there and had them, after a hearing released. He was recalled, came back to the United States, and the four mentioned here had been disgruntled about other matters, they had nothing with reference to the seventh volume. The matter was never intimated. These four, together with the one who went to London, Mr. Johnson, were consorting together, and in a meeting in general, one stated he would see that they ran the matter to suit themselves. They had prepared a set of resolutions taking away from the president the management of the society, were to put one of their number at the Tabernacle to run it there, and another at the Bethel Home, and make the president sit down, notwithstanding the members had made him the general manager, and threatend to tie up all the funds so the president could not do anything, could not expend $100 unless they said so. I knew that was contrary to the wishes of our people all over the country- The Court: That would not be material, the wishes of the people. That was the part about the money. The Witness: They had threatened to tie it up. At this time, while the matter was being discussed, I received from Mr. Butterfield this check. Instead The Court: We are concerned today with the management. The Witness: It had wholly to do with the management, and not the book. Mr. Oeland: Mr. Van Amburgh gave a different version. Mr. Sparks: Then I think we should have the whole story. The Court: Haven't you got it? Mr. Sparks: No; he says he submitted the matter to counsel. Thc Court: We can't go into the question of the advice he got. The only thing material is, another defendant having given a different version, it is the real purpose we want. Mr. Fuller: Another defendant did not give any different story. Mr. Sparks: Mr. Oeland, in his question, intimates that Mr. Rutherford, without any authority, and solely from his own standpoint, was dissatisfied with these men and threw them out. Mr. Oeland: He said so. Mr. Sparks: No, he did not say anything of the kind. The Court: I think be said they were consorting together to make trouble, to tie up Mr. Sparks: He took advice. Mr. Fuller: He didn't put them out; he found that they did not have the power to do it. The Court: That is grinding pretty fine. They were there as defacto officers. I think it was well enough to refer to putting them out. |


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