"JW" Says Donor Organs Cause Personality Changes (and other nonsense) on TV!

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    mummatron posted Thu, 23 Jun 2011 22:53:00 GMT(6/23/2011)

    Post 72 of 578
    Joined 6/1/2011

    http://www.4thought.tv/4thoughts/0354-Derek-House-Should-organ-donation-be-made-compulsory-

    4thought.tv asks if organ donations should be compulsory. Derek House is a Jehovah’s Witness who believes an organ transplant could lead to the recipient having a change of personality.

    This was on TV here in the UK this week. I couldn't believe my eyes and ears when I saw this! Is he an "old-skool" J-Dub? He seems to be talking about the pre-1980's doctrines which have no basis in science. The upshot of it is that it at least shows the JWs can be completely ridiculous. Hopefully it might make a few interested ones think twice! Note the comments - many of them are defending JWs saying he can't really be one. I was brought up being told we don't donate organs (after asking my parents about my classmates' donor cards), then in my late teens hearing accounts of JWs whose lives had been saved by donor organs and being very confused. Is this an issue that has gotten so confused that JWs dont really know what the GB's bottom line is on it anymore?

    Reality79 posted Thu, 23 Jun 2011 23:57:00 GMT(6/23/2011)

    Post 234 of 322
    Joined 1/23/2011

    Hmmmmm.....is this guy REALLY a dub or an imposter?

    I know JWs are clueless anyway but methinks this is acting. The red 'holy bible' is a giveaway.

    Sharpie posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 00:37:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 86 of 109
    Joined 12/25/2009

    Ugh, there is no more "world wide web" anymore because the god damn thing isn't world wide :(

    Yeah, the video isn't aviable in my area so I can't see it. Is there another link that I can see this video at?

    F blondie posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 01:12:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 32202 of 37511
    Joined 5/28/2001

    ( 1970)

    Watching the World/Personality Change...

    According to a report that appeared on United Press International of August 18, 1970, the daughter of Philip Blaiberg said that he had experienced a complete personality change after undergoing a heart-transplant operation. Blaiberg was one of the first to receive a transplanted heart. His daughter observed: "I don’t know if it was the drugs or just the transplant, but he was a different man."

    *** g71 11/22 p. 31 Watching the World ***Disenchantment with Heart Transplants

    Since 1967 doctors have performed 166 heart transplants, but the initial enthusiasm is gone. Too many patients have died—more than 85 percent thus far. There were also bad side effects. There were depression, brief periods of being psychotic, memory lapses, sleeplessness and marked changes in personality. According to Life magazine, immunologists have concluded that "the heart is a peculiar, particular organ, not only a pump, but a creature of some internal, unknown majesty."

    *** w71 3/1 pp. 135-136 pars. 10-12 How Is Your Heart?*** It is significant that heart-transplant patients, where the nerves connecting the heart and brain are severed, have serious emotional problems after the operation. The new heart is still able to operate as a pump, it having its own power supply and timing mechanism independent of the general nervous system for giving impulse to the heart muscle, but just as it now responds only sluggishly to outside influences, the new heart in turn registers few, if any, clear factors of motivation on the brain. To what extent the nerve endings of the body and the new heart are able to make some connections in time is not clear, but this cannot be ruled out as one of the several factors causing the serious mental aberrations and disorientation that doctors report are observed in heart-transplant patients. These patients have donor-supplied pumps for their blood, but do they now have all the factors needed to say they have a "heart"? One thing is sure, in losing their own hearts, they have had taken away from them the capacities of "heart" built up in them over the years and which contributed to making them who they were as to personality.

    MedicalWorldNews (May 23, 1969), in an article entitled "What Does a New Heart Do to the Mind?" reported the following: "At Stanford University Medical Center last year, a 45-year-old man received a new heart from a 20-year-old donor and soon announced to all his friends that he was celebrating his twentieth birthday. Another recipient resolved to live up to the sterling reputation of the prominent local citizen who was the donor. And a third man expressed great fear of feminization upon receiving a woman’s heart, though he was somewhat mollified when he learned that women live longer than men. According to psychiatrist Donald T. Lunde, a consultant to surgeon Norman Shumway’s transplant team at Stanford, these patients represent someofthelessseverementalaberrations [italics ours] observed in the Shumway series of 13 transplants over the last 16 months." The article continues: "Though five patients in the series had survived as of early this month, and four of them were home leading fairly normal lives, three of the nonsurvivors became psychotic before they died last year. And two others have become psychotic this year."

    While the giving of the drug prednisone and the mind-wearying effects of a serious operation and a long confinement under intensive care are given by Dr. Lunde as the chief causes of these strange personality disorders, it is interesting to observe that Dr. Schneider, "a New York psychiatrist-neurologist and a student of heart-brain interaction, sees other factors modifying Dr. Lunde’s explanations for the psychoses encountered in the Shumway heart transplant series. Dr. Schneider . . . maintains that ‘the heart is more than a plumber’s pump—it is a neuroendocrine battery. It has a little brain all its own, the S-A and A-V nodes and the conduction bundle, and the little waves from this bundle can be discerned along with each heart wave on an ECG [electrocardiogram]. Beyond this, the heart’s extensive manufacture and storage of catecholamines may affect the levels of these neurohormones in the hypothalamus.’" (Ibid., page 18) Dr. Schneider observed that many non-heart-transplant patients who were given prednisone or confined for long periods did not get psychoses.

    ***

    w75 9/1 p. 519 Insight on the News ***Transplant Problems

    It has long been known that heart-transplant patients have a higher-than-average amount of postoperative psychiatric problems. But it seems that the same is true with regard to some other vital organ transplants, such as kidney transplants. U.C.L.A. psychiatry professor Dr. Pietro Castelnuovo-Tedesco is quoted as saying: "An outstanding finding following transplantation is the not infrequent occurrence of serious emotional disturbance." One study of 292 kidney-transplant patients showed that nearly 20 percent experienced severe depression after the operation, a few even attempting suicide. By contrast, only about one out of every 1,500 general-surgery patients develops a severe emotional disturbance.

    A peculiar factor sometimes noted is a so-called ‘personality transplant.’ That is, the recipient in some cases has seemed to adopt certain personality factors of the person from whom the organ came. One young promiscuous woman who received a kidney from her older, conservative, well-behaved sister, at first seemed very upset. Then she began imitating her sister in much of her conduct. Another patient claimed to receive a changed outlook on life after his kidney transplant. Following a transplant, one mild-tempered man became aggressive like the donor. The problem may be largely or wholly mental. But it is of interest, at least, that the Bible links the kidneys closely with human emotions.—Compare Jeremiah 17:10 and Revelation 2:23.

    ------------------

    After 1975, no more mention, because by then their "worldly" experts were not longer touting this concept.

    But long after the WTS disavowed previous statements about vaccinations, individual jws were still refusing them based on those old ideas...just like some jws refuse all blood products, all, despite the WTS reworking of the blood transfusion doctrine.

    mummatron posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 01:36:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 74 of 578
    Joined 6/1/2011
    Hmmmmm.....is this guy REALLY a dub or an imposter?
    I know JWs are clueless anyway but methinks this is acting. The red 'holy bible' is a giveaway.

    @Reality79 I did wonder that myself. The Bible looks exactly like the ones you get in hotels. I'm wondering if the production company had it in their props department and made him hold it for effect..?

    @Sharpie Here ya go... I hope you can see this. If not, try finding a UK proxy server so the site thinks you're here, it might get around the issue.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTE-7mWAjbQ&feature=sh_e_sl&list=SL

    Note that comments have been disabled for this video!!!!

    @Blondie Wow you're fast! Thank you so much.

    MrMonroe posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 01:40:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 303 of 595
    Joined 1/2/2010

    Still doesn't work in Australia.

    mummatron posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 01:51:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 75 of 578
    Joined 6/1/2011

    @MrMonroe What about this one..?

    http://www.seesaw.com/TV/Factual/p-42320-Derek-House

    Edited 02:52 GMT to say: Just read SeeSaw's FAQs and discovered that it's UK distribution/airing only.

    This was only aired this week, so I reckon it'll get on to the "Worldwide" part of the web in the next week or so.

    EmptyInside posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 02:00:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 929 of 1880
    Joined 9/26/2009

    I even remember reading in one of the magazines of someone getting,I believe a blood transfusion ,from a known thief. And so he had an urge to steal. But,I don't know about finding the article. It may have been an organ transplant,I don't know,but I remember reading the stealing scenerio.

    mummatron posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 02:21:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 76 of 578
    Joined 6/1/2011

    http://www.betheltours.org/meetus.php http://www.betheltours.org/us.php

    OK, it looks like he's a genuine dub in Carlise Eden cong. Given he runs coach trips to Bethel I'd assume he'd be pretty well known both in his circuit and by some of the (ex) London Bethelites. Must be somebody here on JWN who can confirm this for us...

    BoleynGirl posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 06:13:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 11 of 14
    Joined 6/14/2011

    This is utter rubbish. Correlation is not the same as causation. The WT comments posted by Blondie sound like medieval style "magical thinking", which arose due to ignorance and fear of the unknown - core JW traits. It has been shown that children's vocabulary increases the more cavities they have in their teeth. If we apply WT reasoning, witnesses should therefore feed their kids more candy to be more effective in the door-to-door work. Actually, the correlation is simply because older children have more cavities, and also larger vocabularies.

    I am a psychiatrist and have done my fair share of "consultation liaison" with medical teams. It is well known that ANY major surgical procedure or chronic, life threatening illness can result in depression and/or personality change. Delirium - complete with auditory hallucinations and persecutory delusions can also be caused by many of the anti-rejection drugs, dehydration from surgery, and a multitude of other causes. In the 1960s the most common anti-rejection drug was prednisone which is NOTORIOUS for causing florid psychosis in some people. So I'm not surprised that in the early days of heart transplants, such phenomena were observed. These days the drugs tend to be a little better.

    There is in fact a well-documented syndrome of severe major depression associated with strokes and myocardial infarctions (heart attack). No one knows what the mechanism is, but serotonin levels in the brain apparently do change afterwards. So much so that there are studies giving prophylactic anti-depressants to these people to see if they contribute to quality of life afterwards.

    The point is - yes there ARE psychiatric changes following transplant (and other surgery/medical conditions), but it is impossible to establish cause and effect.

    M dozy posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 09:05:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 918 of 1503
    Joined 2/18/2006

    I know this guy from the tours - used to be an elder but apparently not now (at least I don't see him listed in any of the local congregations)

    http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Showcharity/RegisterOfCharities/SearchMatchList.aspx?RegisteredCharityNumber=0&SubsidiaryNumber=0

    He used to be one of the JWs who ran printing companies (very popular in the UK - some JWs have made big money from them) but sold up last year. http://www.whitehavennews.co.uk/carlisle-print-boss-sells-up-to-work-as-jehovah-s-witness-1.652214?referrerPath=features/money-matters

    I would say he is an old reconstructed JW who still believes the JW stuff pedalled when transplants were banned. I suspect that the WTBTS aren't really very happy at him giving his personal views on what is now a "conscience matter." He is starting from an incorrect premise anyway , as the UK government has no intention of making transplants "compulsory" , merely considering changing the presumption on people opting in to opting out. One wonders whether he would have the same view if he or his children needed a kidney tranplant.

    mummatron posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 20:18:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 80 of 578
    Joined 6/1/2011

    Thanks dozy.

    fade_away posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 21:21:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 93 of 324
    Joined 3/26/2011

    This idea would make an awesome thriller movie! A boy gets a heart transplant from a serial killer that has been put to death recently. The boy now becomes aggressive with his friends and family and sadistic with animals; abusing his dog and killing cats and squirrels. The movie can have a climatic ending similar to The Amitiville Horror where he hunts his family down and kills most of them until the protagonist stabs the boy in the heart and ends his reign of terror.

    lol! Cliche but a fun pop corn movie.

    WontLeave posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 21:48:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 659 of 851
    Joined 9/2/2010

    Sadly, millions of JWs wouldn't recognize this as a prime example of why people aren't supposed to turn their minds over to crazy old men in NY. Rather, they'll see it as a sterling example of why we must always keep up with Jehovah's ever-moving chariot and always partake of every morsel of spiritual food and new light from the faithful and discreet slave.

    They will polish this turd until it shines like a mirror.

    Mad Sweeney posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 22:01:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 5838 of 6963
    Joined 11/2/2009

    Not available outside the UK.

    This isn't the first time this has happened. Anyone know why some UK vids aren't available elsewhere?

    M slimboyfat posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 22:08:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 4716 of 8459
    Joined 11/24/2004
    Anyone know why some UK vids aren't available elsewhere?

    Have you paid the TV license? Here in the UK some like to think we have the best TV news and drama because we pay for it.

    I can't imagine that brother will be very popular after making those ridiculous comments on national TV. In the 1960s of course Milton Henschel himself said something very similar to a reporter. But JWs have gone some distance to try to make themselves appear less wacky since then.

    F Mickey mouse posted Fri, 24 Jun 2011 22:09:00 GMT(6/24/2011)

    Post 3385 of 4402
    Joined 12/11/2007

    What a nobber!

    F Snoozy posted Sat, 25 Jun 2011 01:13:00 GMT(6/25/2011)

    Post 3358 of 3530
    Joined 11/3/2001

    Bolenygirl, I agree with their findings..I too think it is possible to be connected in some way but not sure why. Because of the transplant or because of the trauma/drugs/etc.

    And slimboyfat, how much is a TV license? We have to pay for our cable but can choose from where we get it..

    Snoozy

    ps..One thing about the witnesses..they were usually safe rather than sorry about some things..especially about some vaccines and oral polio .

    baltar447 posted Sat, 25 Jun 2011 03:48:00 GMT(6/25/2011)

    Post 741 of 2299
    Joined 3/11/2006

    cool, time to fire up the ol VPN service so I can watch

    talesin posted Sat, 25 Jun 2011 03:53:00 GMT(6/25/2011)

    Post 7879 of 14465
    Joined 6/24/2003

    ps..One thing about the witnesses..they were usually safe rather than sorry about some things..especially about some vaccines and oral polio .

    Interesting, Snoozy,,, I didn't get vaccinated because of 'blood',,, that was the 60s

    t

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