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March 15, 2010 Watchtower -- "One Flock, One Shepherd"

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    sd-7 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 14:49:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 161 of 3747
    Joined 7/31/2009

    March 15, 2010 Watchtower, p. 27, par. 16 ("One Flock, One Shepherd"):

    "Paul also helps us to understand that those with an earthly hope do not partake of the Memorial emblems. [Wow, putting words in Paul's mouth...] He said to anointed Christians [although he just thought of them as plain old Christians]: "For as often as you eat this loaf and drink this cup, you keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he arrives." (1 Cor. 11:26) When does the Lord 'arrive'? When he comes to take the last of his anointed bride class to their heavenly home. (John 14:2, 3) Clearly, the annual observance of the Lord's Evening Meal is not to continue endlessly...If, though, those who will live forever on earth were entitled to partake of the emblems, then this Memorial meal would need to continue forever."

    Uh, excuse me?! Did they not just quote the Bible as clearly saying the Lord's Evening Meal would be done "until the Lord arrives"? So what possible basis would there be for saying that under ANY circumstances, the Memorial would have to continue forever? We won't need to proclaim the death of the Lord once he has arrived! What would be the logic on this, exactly? Even in my cult identity, I can't figure it out. Maybe it's just a lame excuse for continuing to withhold the bread and wine from the 'other sheep' after having already established in this same article that they symbolically represent "the twelve tribes of Israel". I guess it was the only possible way to dodge the clear implication that if the 'other sheep' deserve that designation, there is no logical reason that they're not part of the "Israel of God" and thus worthy of partaking. What part of "one flock, one shepherd" did they not understand? Worse yet, are they therefore suggesting that Jesus never really 'arrives' for the 'other sheep', but only for THEM? That's an even bolder implication than any of the others. That's just disturbing.

    I don't know if I can even put into words the absurdity of this statement. Who sat down, wrote this, read it and decided it was a good idea to hit 'Print' and allow this to be read to 7,000,000 people? (sigh) It's driving me crazy. I mean, we know the answer to that question, but...geez, people, at least give the other sheep SOMETHING other than the carrot of paradise earth to hold onto. I mean, it's reached a point where they really need to let the 'other sheep' partake. The saddest thing that comes of all this? If or when they finally allow that, the 'other sheep' will be crying tears of joy and be eternally grateful to the SLAVE CLASS for permitting them to have what JESUS, the MASTER, freely offered them from the beginning.

    SD-7

    cantleave posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:09:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 1616 of 13182
    Joined 6/25/2009

    I found this WT very disturbing too. A poster on here suggested it is paving the way for "Noo Lite" and I agree that there is a great deal of ambiguity which could take a number of directions in the future.

    minimus posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:28:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 29640 of 36341
    Joined 7/3/2002

    Everyone knows Jesus arrived in 1914 or 1918 or 1919. We're in Christ's presence.

    M sir82 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:29:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 3716 of 9004
    Joined 5/17/2005
    If, though, those who will live forever on earth were entitled to partake of the emblems, then this Memorial meal would need to continue forever."

    Umm, why exactly would it need to do so?

    They are desperately trying to stem the tide of "new anointed". As the number climbs past 10,000, and well on its way to 20,000 or more, it will raise questions in the minds of the R&F about the validity of teaching that the 144,000 is literal.

    If there were 10's of thousands of "true anointed ones" in the 1st century, and in the 1930's, and in the 21st century, as well as many thousands more between 100 AD and 1879 AD, how exactly does that add up to only 144,000?

    Although it's odd that this is in the March WT and won't be studied until May or so, well after the 2010 Memorial.

    minimus posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:32:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 29641 of 36341
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    They'll stop posting the number partaking.

    Joshnaz posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:36:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 284 of 413
    Joined 4/15/2009

    I like my picture of this alien Crab guy

    M undercover posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:38:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 8395 of 13134
    Joined 9/25/2002

    Speaking of which... (not the alien crab guy but minimus' post - cross posting)

    Has last year's partaker numbers been released yet? It used to come out in the February WT, IIRC, but if they're not doing that anymore shouldn't it be in the yearbook as well? Hasn't it come out yet?

    M civicsi00 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:40:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 532 of 616
    Joined 10/24/2007

    I know, it's a very disturbing article. I was disgusted with the way they continually beat the "other sheep" into submissive morons for their enjoyment.

    If or when they finally allow that, the 'other sheep' will be crying tears of joy and be eternally grateful to the SLAVE CLASS for permitting them to have what JESUS, the MASTER, freely offered them from the beginning.

    And thus they will be denied eternal life because they didn't listen to the Master, but instead followed their False Prophet wherever it went.

    Chalam posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:43:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 2434 of 4243
    Joined 12/29/2007

    So what's the full scoop? The title looks interesting, "One Flock, One Shepherd".

    Are they going to try and further confuse the JWs with their previous two flock, two shepherd teaching?!

    Blessings,

    Stephen

    F snowbird posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:46:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 11838 of 23468
    Joined 5/2/2007

    Curse the WT to time indefinite for its blasphemous teaching that has divided those seeking the Savior!

    Amen.

    Sylvia

    cantleave posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:46:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 1619 of 13182
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    The number hasn't been released yet. The 2010 year book is due in February.

    M sir82 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:46:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 3717 of 9004
    Joined 5/17/2005
    Are they going to try and further confuse the JWs with their previous two flock, two shepherd teaching?!

    Yep. "One flock means one flock, unless it means 2 flocks. Say, have you ever wondered what the word 'generation' means?"

    Chalam posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:52:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 2435 of 4243
    Joined 12/29/2007

    One thing is clear, the WT make it up as they go along. My guess is titles like this is damage limitation from their clear heresy.

    John 10:16 (New International Version)

    16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.

    John 11:51-52 (New International Version)

    51 He did not say this on his own, but as high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the Jewish nation, 52 and not only for that nation but also for the scattered children of God, to bring them together and make them one.

    Blessings,

    Stephen

    F Mary posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:54:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 10939 of 12737
    Joined 6/26/2002
    If, though, those who will live forever on earth were entitled to partake of the emblems, then this Memorial meal would need to continue forever."

    Yes, it makes you wonder what they're smoking in the Writing Department when you read this sort of tripe. Even if you take their views of the two-tiered class of Christians at face value, it doesn't make any sense. If "those who will live forever on earth were entitled to partake of the emblems", wouldn't that mean that we weren't destined to "live forever on earth" at all but would have a heavenly hope?

    I agree----this is a desperate attempt for them to try and explain away why more and more are taking the emblems each year, despite their stern warnings against it. It's utterly laughable. They could easily rectify the situation in a few ways:

    1. Admit that the "144,000" number in Revelation is symbolic and includes all Christians
    2. Admit that the "Great Crowd" in Revelation also have a heavenly hope
    3. Or even if they wanted to keep everyone with an 'earthly hope', they could still allow them to participate of the emblems, thereby blending the numbers of the two classes so that no one would actually 'know' how many of the 'annointed' there actually were.

    But instead of doing something logical, they instead have to go to the ends of the earth, speaking in circles to try to reassert their lame-brain interpretation of the scriptures.

    M leavingwt posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:58:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

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    cameo-d posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 16:18:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

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    "For as often as you eat this loaf and drink this cup, you keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he arrives."

    Since they are still drinking from the cup...this can only mean that the Lord has not arrived.

    This would invalidate the 1914 claim of the arrival.

    M alanv posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 16:27:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 177 of 812
    Joined 12/20/2005

    Cantleave. Is that right or just a joke that the Yearbook will be out in February. Also is not the 2009 service report coming out in an incert in Kingdom Ministry. Surely both should be out by now!

    M thetrueone posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 16:49:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 358 of 5528
    Joined 9/18/2006

    Sounds like there is confusion and they don't know of which direction to go.

    In anycase they will spin something out, trying maneuver their previous bullshit to make room

    for the new bullshit is what they're good at.

    Room 215 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 17:03:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 2171 of 2914
    Joined 4/16/2001

    Friends, this is another of their annual "don't partake" articles; they appear like clockwork along with other signs of spring, like daffodils. A bit later in the year, they trot out another perennial favorite: the "please don't misbehave at the district convention," although that one's usually reserved for the Kingdom Ministry.

    Room 215 posted Tue, 29 Dec 2009 17:07:00 GMT(12/29/2009)

    Post 2172 of 2914
    Joined 4/16/2001

    Mary: I've long been a proponent of your suggestion 3; it's easily the most pragmatic way out of the corner they've painted themselves into

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