Why does God allow people to develop 'forbidden' special powers?

Viewed 6166 times

    F SM62 posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 11:44:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 130 of 168
    Joined 9/2/2003

    Something I have been wondering about lately.

    Whether you believe in God or not, are a Christian or some other religion or no religion at all, I'd be interested in your opinion.

    According to those who believe in the Bible including most Christians, God condemns the use of 'special' powers/abilities. For example, ESP, tarot, astrology, consulting a medium, spells etc. However, If God created us, did he not give us the ability to develop and use such powers? I am convinced some people have some sort of special gift - they can see/do things that others can't. They can't all be charlatans or head-cases, can they? Why would God give us the ability to develop these special powers, and then condemn us to destruction for tapping into such things? It doesn't really make sense. If he created everything, he created these powers also. Why allow humans access to such things if we aren't allowed to go near them or even research them, for fear of the 'demons'. Also, for those who have no beliefs, would you shy away from such things out of fear, and if so, fear of what?

    Also, according to the Bible, God allowed humans to use special powers in the past, such as phrophesying, healing the sick, raising the dead, speaking lots of languages. If it was ok for them to do it back then, why can't we look into the paranormal now, or am I being really dense?

    Basically, what I am rambling about is this - Why give humans special abilities and then destroy them for using these abilities?

    Ta

    Terri

    M Gopher posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 12:44:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 4220 of 10951
    Joined 3/18/2001
    Why would God give us the ability to develop these special powers, and then condemn us to destruction for tapping into such things?

    Perhaps because Jehovah (or whatever you wish to call the Creator or the great spirit) is jealous that such activities would take attention away from him/her/it.

    Remember in the NT when Herod impressed a crowd while speaking, and the Bible god struck him down for not assigning him proper glory?

    F plmkrzy posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 12:56:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 5497 of 5673
    Joined 1/13/2002

    I've heard many different reasons but the one I heard most while a JW was because we, as imperfect humans, are too stupid to know the difference between a special power and a trick imposed on us by a demon. In a nutshell that is. We would be gambling with our faith in a sense by not putting our complete trust in god but instead looking to the stars or the dead for answers because we do not yet have the maturity to understand such powers and keep them in there proper place. Just like that fruit tree .

    M gumby posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 13:09:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 6035 of 13036
    Joined 7/22/2001
    If it was ok for them to do it back then, why can't we look into the paranormal now, or am I being really dense?

    Basically, what I am rambling about is this - Why give humans special abilities and then destroy them for using these abilities?

    First of all.......I have never seen a person with a special gift as you mention. There are many who claim to have these gifts.......but have YOU ever met such a person? Do you have PROOF they have a gift? Name them and what they do that is special if you could.

    As for your question of it being right or wrong......it seems it was OK if god gave the ability to someone. If they had a gift apart from gods backing, then it was evil and the powers were suggested as coming from Satan. Silly eh?

    It seems there must be some truths in astrology or god could have said....."go ahead and gaze away and see if these stars of mine contain any truths....your wasting your time".

    If you DO find an authentic person with a special power.....I'd like to know in all seriousness. I too always wondered if any of these claimed special people have ANY validity to them.

    Gumby

    Gumby

    M Thirdson posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 14:27:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 1103 of 1265
    Joined 2/5/2001

    I hear Michael Jackson has a friend who can bend spoons through special powers.

    3rd

    BTW I can bend spoons by over use of my limited physical power. Now if I could do it on the sly maybe I could get rich by claining special finger rubbing and mind talents. See some skeptics sites too

    Nathan Natas posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:07:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 3349 of 9583
    Joined 4/25/2001

    People who chose to believe the claims of metaphysicians turn the world upside down.

    Are there people who really have special powers?

    Yes but none of them are phoney metaphysicians, whose "powers" can solve the world's unbent spoon shortage or who tells us that dead Aunt Tilly wants us to remind her what her favorite color was.

    Real special powers come from the development and use of the rational analytical mind, not from the mojo bag of some superstitious shaman.

    There is no "spirit realm" populated with any sort of immaterial intelligent creatures.

    God is a sock puppet who speaks only when he has a priest's arm run up his ass.

    M gumby posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:46:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 6039 of 13036
    Joined 7/22/2001
    God is a sock puppet who speaks only when he has a priest's arm run up his ass.

    Boy oh boy would I hate to be your sorry ass when armaggeddon strikes!

    Gumby

    M Simon posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:04:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 10784 of 15256
    Joined 3/23/2000

    hmmn ... seeing as no one seems to have any of these claimed special powers when they are actually tested scientifically I'd have to say that God isn't really 'allowing' people to develop them.

    Having said that though, I think the existence of God is on pretty much the same level - lots of people claim to have evidence but non one can ever produce any !

    I guess both come down to blind faith.

    F SM62 posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:14:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 131 of 168
    Joined 9/2/2003

    Gopher - that's an interesting point about God being jealous - it does say somewhere in the Bible (wish I'd paid more attention at the meetings) that God is a jealous God, but I never thought of it the way you put it, that he wants all the attention for himself like a spoilt child.

    Plmkrzy - I was never given that reason as a JW. I can see their point though - what if you were dabbling with something that seemed harmless. but which wanted to harm you? I am sure that I wouldn't be that daft, though. I would check things out first.

    Gumby - I have never had a supernatural experience, and I get annoyed about that sometimes. If there are special powers, why don't I have them? But having said that, the last time there was a post about people who have had strange experiences, or had seen a ghost or something, there were so many who had seen strange things. They can't all be liars can they? I know loads of people who say they have seen people who have been dead for years. I would like to go to a clairvoyant or something one day, just to see if they can tell me accurate things about my past - I wouldn't want to hear vague stuff such as 'The letter J figures predominantly in your life' or 'I have an old man here in a grey suit' or rubbish like that - I would want names, dates etc.

    Thirdson - I have never believed in Uri Geller - plus he always bored the pants off me.

    Nathan Natas -

    There is no "spirit realm" populated with any sort of immaterial intelligent creatures.

    How do you know this? How do you account for all the weird sightings around the world? Are you saying the millions of people over the centuries who have had paranormal experiences such as seeing dead people are lying? Or are they all mad? I don't really know what to believe, but I always keep an open mind.

    Thanks for your thoughts.

    Terri

    F SM62 posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 132 of 168
    Joined 9/2/2003

    But Simon, loads of genuine people have seen ghostly sightings. These are people who are not seeking attention or anything - most of them weren't even thinking about seeing a ghost - things just appeared to them. Why does that happen? How can you scientifically 'prove' what someone is seeing, if you can't see it yourself?

    There are people who can take an object belonging to someone, and they can give details about that person - really accurate details. How do they do that? And why is it wrong to try to develop such powers? If it is possible to develop psychic powers, such as telepathy, why is it wrong? I don't understand that. You are not harming anyone by doing it, so why does the Bible condemn it?

    Terri

    M gumby posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:26:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 6044 of 13036
    Joined 7/22/2001
    But having said that, the last time there was a post about people who have had strange experiences, or had seen a ghost or something, there were so many who had seen strange things. They can't all be liars can they?

    Hi terri,

    I also have in the past started threads concerning proof of ghosts, spirits, weird happening and such. Nearly all stories are told with only one witness. Rarely is a story told in which two or more have said they saw a CLEAR figure, heard a CLEARLY audible voice with nobody else around, etc. Many truely think they see and hear things. Some are dreams, some are mind games. People don't always lie about these things as many truely believe they saw or heard something.

    What is depressing about all these stories is, there is never a recording, or a TRUE photo, or a GROUP, who can undeniably attest they ALL saw something that was clearly a supernatural event. That's the problem with the paranormal, god, ghosts, spirits, demon, whatever. Never any proof.

    Gumby

    Gumby

    aniron posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:55:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 7 of 1121
    Joined 9/12/2003

    Maybe God forbade such people with "special powers" because he knew that they would start to have influence over peoples lives. Look at the number of people today whose lives are based on what their astrologer says. Or what they have been told by some medium or ther means. Or what the Tarot cards tell them.

    F Mulan posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:14:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 5358 of 9647
    Joined 3/22/2001

    I think there are many things we just can't explain. For example, I dreamed the other night that a friend was engaged. She had been in a long term relationship and I did know they would eventually get engaged, but I dreamed it one night. The next day, she called me, saying he gave her a ring the night before. Coincidence, .............maybe.

    All of us have probably had the experience of thinking about someone we hadn't heard from in a long time, and the phone rings, and guess what? It is that person. I think that likely there are thought waves that do travel and connect. (simplified explanation) It happens pretty often to me, and I don't think I have any special gifts...............but I can see auras.

    M drwtsn32 posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:36:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 3376 of 6460
    Joined 5/4/2003

    Auras? I think most people can see them. But it's probably not what you think. When you stare (directly or indirectly) at an object, epecially when it contrasts greatly with the background, retinal fatigue starts to kick in. This causes the object to be slightly visible (for a brief moment) even when you close your eyes. It also causes an apparent "field" to grow around the object. This only works when you keep your eyes stationary. If you move them, the object is moved to a different part of your retina and you have to stare at it for a while before the "aura" will reappear.

    But to get back on topic, I'm a skeptic and don't believe in any special powers. I believe in coincidences though. If a special power was real then it could be validated by a controlled test. So far that hasn't happened.

    F Mulan posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:44:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 5362 of 9647
    Joined 3/22/2001
    When you stare (directly or indirectly) at an object, epecially when it contrasts greatly with the background, retinal fatigue starts to kick in.

    That isn't how I do it. I have to think about seeing the aura, or I don't consciously see it. When someone asks me what color their aura is, or how big it is, I definitely just look at them, and it is there. Some people have big auras that go far out from their bodies, and others have tiny ones that skim the edges of their body. Many different colors too. I have found the most common color is yellow. My husband's is blue and my mother's is large and yellow.

    F jgnat posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:54:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 2746 of 24322
    Joined 7/4/2002

    What did mankind do when he discovered the power of the atom? I think that is your answer.

    Nathan Natas posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:06:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 3354 of 9583
    Joined 4/25/2001

    SM62,

    You asked,

    How do you know this? How do you account for all the weird sightings around the world? Are you saying the millions of people over the centuries who have had paranormal experiences such as seeing dead people are lying? Or are they all mad? I don't really know what to believe, but I always keep an open mind.

    It is funny, knowing what we know of psychology, that people are so willing to believe that they are unimpeachable witnesses of supernatural events in the world outside their heads, rather than accept that emotional states, hallucinations, hypoxia, etc., could easily explain their experiences.

    Do you believe in "cause and effect," or do you believe that we live in a world where "stuff happens" that is completely contrary to the rules of the real world that we depend on each day: when preparing breakfast, for example.

    It may be tempting to believe that a world exists with no apparent rules, no apparent principle of cause and effect. Really, if you accept this baloney, how do you get through the day intact? How do you know that any particular experience is in the REAL world, and not simply the result of a supernatural deception? How do you know that the next time you pick up a pencil, it won't turn into a snake? ..or that you won't suddenly become quite tiny and fall into the ocean of coffee in your coffee cup? Or that your kitchen window won't start a conversation with you while your refrigerator dances the jig? These things might not be unexpected or impossible if there was a supernatural world. Do your dead relatives care so little for you that they won't tell you what the next XEROX-like stock will be, but they keep reminding you of the puppy who ran across a meadow?

    I'm glad to hear that you have an open mind and are willing to consider that THIS world is IT.

    I know that there is no spirit realm populated with any sort of intelligent, invisible, immaterial beings simply because there is no evidence of such a realm.

    The principle of analytical thought known as "Occam's Razor" suggests that when there are multiple "explanations" for an event, it is likely that the simplest explanation is most accurate. In other words, why create an entire imaginary world to explain that you had a dream?

    (for more about Occam's Razor, see http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/OCCAMRAZ.html)

    All (ALL!) of the progress of the human race has been the result of man's mind (analytical thought) and man's back (labor).

    No supernatural manna has ever come from the great beyond, no miraculous city has descended from heaven.

    F Frannie Banannie posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:06:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 1847 of 5854
    Joined 8/8/2003

    I know but I'm not gonna tell yall, cause yall wouldn't believe it anyway.....but here's a clue.....it isn't God himself that's jealous of God-given extra-sensory powers in humans that might distract us from God's "word".....Think about it.

    Frannie B

    wednesday posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:10:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 2282 of 5289
    Joined 9/1/2002

    My hubby and i once saw a cloud of black smoke go through our bedroom wall. We were in the adjoining bath and both getting a shower. I saw it first, and called his attention to it, and we both did see it at the same time. It just floated through the wall, and that was it.

    M drwtsn32 posted Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:18:00 GMT(1/25/2004)

    Post 3377 of 6460
    Joined 5/4/2003
    That isn't how I do it. I have to think about seeing the aura, or I don't consciously see it. When someone asks me what color their aura is, or how big it is, I definitely just look at them, and it is there. Some people have big auras that go far out from their bodies, and others have tiny ones that skim the edges of their body. Many different colors too. I have found the most common color is yellow. My husband's is blue and my mother's is large and yellow.

    Interesting Mulan. Do you instantly see it or does it take several seconds to appear? If it is basically instant then you're right... basic retinal fatigue would not explain it. I wonder why these auras can't be captured with any sort of photographic equipment.

      Close

      Confirm ...