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Ridiculous article I found about anointed going to heaven/partaking of emblems

    lilbluekitty posted Fri, 20 Jan 2012 04:20:00 GMT(1/20/2012)

    Post 196 of 308
    Joined 10/13/2011

    I'm copy/pasting this from the CD Rom (I only have the 2008 one and older ones), Watchtower 2/15/03. I was browsing to refresh my memory what JWs believe about who can partake of the memorial because the church I go to now has the Lord's Supper every Sunday as part of their worship.

    My husband and I recently met with the lead pastor (totally cool guy, he's bald with a beard and wears normal teeshirts and grungy jeans and has tattoos) and I told him I used to be a JW who recently started to become a Christian (I'm not born again yet) and I wanted to know if I could take the Supper like everyone else. The church has an open communion but tells people that if you're not a believer then you're taking it unworthily (1 Cor. 11:27). But basically you don't have to be a member to partake. So the pastor asked me if I'm a believer, have I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior? I said yes. He said then I can partake. I said, do I need to be born again? (I just wanted to make sure) and he said being born again (baptized) and the Lord's Supper are just symbols, they don't save you, etc. Anyway, since I'll be taking the Lord's Supper for the first time this weeked, I just wondered what the dubs say about partaking and all that jazz.

    I found this article to be totally ridiculous about only the anointed partaking and only the annointed going to heaven and crap. My current belief is that I'm going to heaven. I don't know yet what I'll be doing there but I don't think I'm of the 144,000, I just think we all go to heaven when we die as long as we have Jesus as our Lord. I haven't decided what I believe about hell yet but I don't want to find out the hard way :P

    Anyway, anything in red is my opinion, anything highlighted is particularly outrageous to me. Feel free to give your opinion on any of these subjects like who you think the anointed are, who you think is going to heaven (if you believe), etc.

    What Does the Lord’s Evening Meal Mean to You?

    “Whoever eats the loaf or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty respecting the body and the blood of the Lord.”—1 CORINTHIANS 11:27.

    THE most important event planned for the year 2003 is to take place after sundown on April 16. Jehovah’s Witnesses will then meet to observe the Memorial of Jesus Christ’s death. As shown in the preceding article, Jesus instituted this observance, also called the Lord’s Evening Meal, after he and his apostles celebrated the Passover on Nisan 14, 33 C.E. The Memorial emblems of unleavened bread and red wine symbolize Christ’s sinless body and his shed blood—the only sacrifice that can redeem mankind from inherited sin and death.—Romans 5:12; 6:23.

    2 Those partaking of the Memorial emblems must do so worthily. The apostle Paul made that clear when he wrote to Christians in ancient Corinth, where the Lord’s Evening Meal was not being observed in a proper way. (1 Corinthians 11:20-22) Paul wrote: “Whoever eats the loaf or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty respecting the body and the blood of the Lord.” (1 Corinthians 11:27) What is the significance of those words?

    Some Observed It Unworthily

    3 Many Corinthian Christians partook of the Memorial unworthily. There were divisions among them, and at least for a time, some brought their supper and ate it before or during the meeting, often eating and drinking excessively. They were neither mentally nor spiritually alert. This made them “guilty respecting the body and the blood of the Lord.” Those who had no supper were hungry and became distracted. Yes, many partook without respect and full realization of the seriousness of the event. No wonder they brought judgment upon themselves!—1 Corinthians 11:27-34.

    4 As the Memorial approaches each year, self-scrutiny is essential for those who customarily partake of the emblems. To share in this communion meal properly, they must be in a healthy spiritual condition. Anyone who shows disrespect, even contempt, for Jesus’ sacrifice would be in danger of being ‘cut off from God’s people,’ just like an Israelite who partook of a communion meal in an unclean state.—Leviticus 7:20; Hebrews 10:28-31. To me, JWs definitely show contempt or disrespect for Jesus' sacrifice!

    5 Paul compared the Memorial to a communion meal in ancient Israel. He spoke of the partakers sharing together in Christ and then said: “You cannot be drinking the cup of Jehovah and the cup of demons; you cannot be partaking of ‘the table of Jehovah’ and the table of demons.” (1 Corinthians 10:16-21) If a person who usually partakes of the Memorial emblems commits a serious sin, he should confess this to Jehovah and also seek the spiritual assistance of the older men of the congregation. (Proverbs 28:13; James 5:13-16) If he truly repents and produces fruitage befitting repentance, he would not be partaking unworthily.—Luke 3:8.

    Attending as Respectful Observers

    6 Should those now doing good to the remnant of the 144,000 brothers of Christ partake of the Lord’s Evening Meal? (Matthew 25:31-40; Revelation 14:1) No. God has reserved that privilege for individuals he has anointed with holy spirit to be “joint heirs with Christ.” (Romans 8:14-18; 1 John 2:20) What, then, is the position of those who hope to live forever in a global paradise under Kingdom rule? (Luke 23:43; Revelation 21:3, 4) Since they are not Jesus’ joint heirs with a heavenly hope, they attend the Memorial as respectful observers.—Romans 6:3-5. What's the point of going then, if you can't partake?

    7 True Christians in the first century were anointed by holy spirit. Many of them were able to use one or more of the miraculous gifts of the spirit, such as speaking in tongues. Therefore, it would not have been difficult for such individuals to know that they were spirit-anointed and should partake of the Memorial emblems. However, in our time, this can be determined on the basis of such inspired words as these: “All who are led by God’s spirit, these are God’s sons. For you did not receive a spirit of slavery causing fear again, but you received a spirit of adoption as sons, by which spirit we cry out: ‘Abba, Father!’”—Romans 8:14, 15. So for the rank and file, God isn't their Father?

    8 Over the centuries, genuine anointed ones grew as “wheat” in a field of “weeds,” or false Christians. (Matthew 13:24-30, 36-43) Since the 1870’s, the “wheat” became increasingly evident, and some years later anointed Christian overseers were told: “The elders . . . should set before those who assemble themselves [for the Memorial] these terms and conditions,—(1) faith in the blood [of Christ]; and (2) consecration to the Lord and his service, even unto death. They should then invite all who are thus minded and thus consecrated to join in celebrating the Lord’s death.”—Studies in the Scriptures, Series VI, The New Creation, page 473. I never noticed Christians boasting so much about themselves in their literature the way JWs do...

    Searching for “Other Sheep”

    9 In time, Jehovah’s organization began to focus attention on others in addition to Christ’s anointed followers. A notable development along these lines took place in the mid-1930’s. Before then, God’s people viewed the “great crowd” of Revelation 7:9 as a secondary spiritual class that would be associated with the 144,000 resurrected anointed ones in heaven—like bridesmaids or companions of the bride of Christ. (Psalm 45:14, 15; Revelation 7:4; 21:2, 9) But on May 31, 1935, in a discourse given at a convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Washington, D.C., U.S.A., it was Scripturally explained that the “great crowd” (“great multitude,” King James Version) refers to the “other sheep” who live during the time of the end. (John 10:16) After that convention, some who had previously partaken of the Memorial emblems stopped partaking because they realized that their hope was earthly, not heavenly. After one talk?? Sounds like brainwashing to me!

    10 Especially since 1935 has there been a search for those who come to be “other sheep,” who have faith in the ransom, dedicate themselves to God, and support the anointed “little flock” in Kingdom-preaching activity. (Luke 12:32) These other sheep hope to live on earth forever, but in all other respects, they resemble the present-day remnant of Kingdom heirs. Like ancient Israel’s alien residents who worshiped Jehovah and submitted to the Law, today’s other sheep accept Christian responsibilities, such as preaching the good news along with the members of spiritual Israel. (Galatians 6:16) Just as no alien resident could become Israel’s king or a priest, however, none of these other sheep can as such rule in the heavenly Kingdom or serve as priests.—Deuteronomy 17:15.

    11 By the 1930’s, then, it was becoming clear that, in general, the heavenly class had been chosen. For decades now, the search has been for other sheep, whose hope is earthly. If an anointed one proves unfaithful, it is most likely that a person who has long served God faithfully as one of the other sheep would be called to fill the vacancy thus caused in the 144,000. This one was the most laughable of all statements in the entire article. Where's the Biblical basis for that??

    Why Mistaken Assumptions

    12 Anointed Christians are absolutely sure that they have the heavenly calling. Only the annointed? I'm sure I'm going to heaven... But what if some individuals who lack this call have been partaking of the Memorial emblems? Now aware that they never had the heavenly hope, Yeah, how? surely their conscience will compel them to stop partaking. Or their brainwashed conscience. God would not look with favor upon anyone representing himself as a person called to be a heavenly king and priest when he knew that he really did not have such a calling. (Romans 9:16; Revelation 20:6) Jehovah executed the Levite Korah for presumptuously seeking the Aaronic priesthood. (Exodus 28:1; Numbers 16:4-11, 31-35) If any Christian comes to realize that he has wrongly partaken of the Memorial emblems, he or she should stop partaking and humbly pray for Jehovah’s forgiveness.—Psalm 19:13.

    13 Why might some mistakenly assume that they have the heavenly calling? The death of a mate or some other tragedy might cause them to lose interest in life on earth. Or they might desire the same destiny as a close friend who professes to be an anointed Christian. Of course, God has not assigned anyone to recruit others for this privilege. And he does not anoint Kingdom heirs by causing them to hear voices with messages to that effect.

    14 The false religious idea that all good people go to heaven might lead some to think that they have the heavenly calling. Hence, we need to guard against being swayed by past wrong views or other factors. For instance, some might ask themselves: ‘Do I use medications that affect my emotions? Am I inclined to have deep emotions that I could misjudge?’WTF??? So if I think I'm going to heaven I'm mentally ill??

    15 A few might ask themselves: ‘Do I want to be prominent? Am I ambitious for authority now or as a future joint heir with Christ?’ When Kingdom heirs were called in the first century, not all of them had responsible positions in the congregation. And individuals with the heavenly calling do not seek prominence or boast about being anointed.Many JWs do though who say they're annointed... They display the humility expected of those having “the mind of Christ.”—1 Corinthians 2:16.

    16 Some may have concluded that they have the heavenly calling because they have acquired considerable Bible knowledge. But spirit anointing does not bring extraordinary understanding, for Paul had to instruct and counsel certain anointed ones. (1 Corinthians 3:1-3; Hebrews 5:11-14) God has an arrangement for providing spiritual food for all his people. (Matthew 24:45-47) So nobody should think that being an anointed Christian gives him wisdom superior to that of those having the earthly hope. Spirit anointing is not indicated by proficiency in answering Scriptural questions, witnessing, or giving Bible talks. Christians with the earthly hope also do well in these respects.

    17 If a fellow believer asks about the heavenly calling, an elder or other mature Christian can discuss the matter with him. However, one person cannot make this decision for another. A person who truly has this calling does not need to ask others if he has such a hope. Anointed ones “have been given a new birth, not by corruptible, but by incorruptible reproductive seed, through the word of the living and enduring God.” (1 Peter 1:23) By his spirit and Word, God implants the “seed” that makes the individual “a new creation,” with a heavenly hope. (2 Corinthians 5:17) And Jehovah makes the choice. Anointing “depends, not upon the one wishing nor upon the one running, but upon God.” (Romans 9:16) So how can a person be sure that he has the heavenly calling?

    Why They Are Sure

    18 The witness of God’s spirit convinces anointed Christians that they have heavenly prospects. “You received a spirit of adoption as sons,” wrote Paul, “by which spirit we cry out: ‘Abba, Father!’ The spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are God’s children. If, then, we are children, we are also heirs: heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ, provided we suffer together that we may also be glorified together.” (Romans 8:15-17) Under the holy spirit’s influence, the spirit, or dominant attitude, of anointed ones impels them to apply to themselves what the Scriptures say about Jehovah’s spiritual children. (1 John 3:2) God’s spirit gives them a sense of sonship toward him and engenders within them a unique hope. (Galatians 4:6, 7) Yes, everlasting earthly life as perfect humans surrounded by family members and friends would be splendid, but that is not their God-given hope. By means of his spirit, God has produced within them such a strong heavenly hope that they are willing to sacrifice all earthly attachments and prospects.—2 Corinthians 5:1-5, 8; 2 Peter 1:13, 14.

    19 Anointed Christians are certain of their heavenly hope, of their having been taken into the new covenant. Jesus mentioned it when he instituted the Memorial and said: “This cup means the new covenant by virtue of my blood, which is to be poured out in your behalf.” (Luke 22:20) The parties to the new covenant are God and anointed ones. (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Hebrews 12:22-24) Jesus is the mediator. Made operative by Christ’s shed blood, the new covenant took out not only from the Jews but also from the nations a people for Jehovah’s name and made them part of Abraham’s “seed.” (Galatians 3:26-29; Acts 15:14) This “everlasting covenant” provides for all spiritual Israelites to be resurrected to immortal life in heaven.—Hebrews 13:20. Doesn't the new covenant simply mean we're no longer under Mosaic law but under Jesus' law of love?

    20 The anointed are sure of their hope. They have been taken into an additional covenant, the Kingdom covenant. Yeah, show me that scripture... Concerning their sharing with Christ, Jesus said: “You are the ones that have stuck with me in my trials; and I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom.” (Luke 22:28-30) This covenant between Christ and his associate kings remains forever operative.—Revelation 22:5.

    The Memorial Season—A Blessed Time

    21 Many are the blessings of the Memorial season. We can benefit from the Bible reading scheduled for this period. It is also an especially fine time for prayer, for meditation on Jesus’ earthly life and death, and for participation in the Kingdom-preaching work. (Psalm 77:12; Philippians 4:6, 7) The observance itself reminds us of the love shown by God and Christ in connection with Jesus’ ransom sacrifice. (Matthew 20:28; John 3:16) This provision gives us hope and comfort and should bolster our determination to pursue a Christlike course. (Exodus 34:6; Hebrews 12:3) The Memorial should also strengthen us to fulfill our dedication as God’s servants and to be loyal followers of his dear Son.

    22 What good gifts Jehovah gives us! (James 1:17) We have the guidance of his Word, the help of his spirit, and the hope of eternal life. God’s greatest gift is Jesus’ sacrifice for the sins of anointed ones and for all others who exercise faith. (1 John 2:1, 2) So how much does Jesus’ death mean to you? Will you be among those who show gratitude for it by gathering after sundown on April 16, 2003, to observe the Lord’s Evening Meal?

    arko_n9ne posted Fri, 20 Jan 2012 04:56:00 GMT(1/20/2012)

    Post 69 of 93
    Joined 12/17/2011

    Chuck Russell had a choice of Heaven, Paradise on Earth, or Immortality on a distant planet.

    No kidding, he went for all three. Up until the 50's, when people couldn't get a good look at the pleities (spelled wrong I believe), the WTS said God's throne was on a star up there.

    Now, the whole "144,000" thing is a way to express value in the anointed. The anointed being the FDS/GB. If they alone are worthy of Heaven and the partaking of the memorial, then "truly" their word is valued by God. It's crap.

    The bible says heaven. The 12 tribes of Israel was a literal census of the 12,000 from each actual tribe marked for heaven. They will try to relate it to a spiritual Israel, but in fact, the Mayans and Native Americans and Africans, etc. etc., they had no connection to the Abrahamic faith. They were around long before Israel and cannot be included in the census, spiritually or physically because they do not share bloodlines and could not recognize Jesus as Savior for 1400 years after the death of said Savior.

    Personally, I believe the promise of heaven/paradise is a contradiction. My older brother is dead but he was a blatant sinner. He knew right from wrong and chose answer B most times. He cannot inherit the Kingdom. He cannot be in heaven/paradise.
    But I love my older brother. Everything I was, am, will ever be, I owe to him for protecting me and teaching me how things work. If I make it to heaven/paradise, I am promised he will be there. "Surrounded by those you love."

    If he's there, it becomes a contradiction of the divine Word. If he isn't, it becomes a broken promise from God.

    Personally, I believe in a more faith based scientific idea. Nothing ever disappears. Ever. Even the concept of heaven and hell support that scientific law. I believe that when we die, our spirit (the countless electric explosions that run our body, thoughts, and chemistry) leaves our bodies and returns to the electromagnetic field created by the earth. Which was created through millions of years of natural occurance, which was created by God.

    But that's me.

    Enjoy the wafer and the wine. Have fun in heaven, and don't let anyone tell you your beliefs are wrong.

    lilbluekitty posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 03:05:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 200 of 308
    Joined 10/13/2011

    Hope it's cool to bump my own thread, I only got one reply...

    F blondie posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 03:33:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 33209 of 37323
    Joined 5/28/2001

    Pleiades Constellation

    The Pleiades are a dipper-shaped cluster of stars situated in the "shoulder" of the constellation Taurus. To the ancient Romans the constellation of the Pleiades was known for its association with homosexuality. In the 20th Century it was popularised by the UFO and flying saucer buffs. Also known as The Seven Sisters it is mentioned in the Bible in Job 9:9, Job 38:31 and alluded to in Amos 5:8.The constellation symbol is found on the west tower of the Mormon Temple and was known by the Egyptians as the "Dragon of the Seven Stars."

    I have heard Witnesses belittle the Mormon belief that they shall rule on planets as Gods. It may surprise these people that both Russell and Rutherford taught that when they died they would be taken to the Pleiades constellation, which was said to be the dwelling place of God. This is a close parallel with the Mormons belief, that on their resurrection they become gods on various planets.

    Russell took this idea from Seiss. Seiss taught that the physical construction of the Great Pyramid indicated that Alcyone (the central star in the Pleiades constellation) is at the centre of the universe. This belief appears in Studies in the Scriptures, Series 3 page 327.

    Rutherford continued with the teaching in the 1928 book Reconciliation, and said on page 14:

    "The constellation of the seven stars forming the Pleides appears to be the crowning center around which the known systems of the planets revolve even as our sun's planets obey the sun and travel in their respective orbits. It has been suggested, and with much weight, that one of the stars of that group is the dwelling-place of Jehovah and the place of the highest heavens; that it is the place to which the inspired writer referred when he said: "Hear thou from thy dwelling place, even from heaven" (2 Chron. 6:21); and that it is the place to which Job referred when under inspiration he wrote: "Canst thou bind the sweet influences of Pleiades, or loose the bands of Orion?"--Job 38:31.

    The constellation of the Pleiades is a small one compared with others which scientific instruments disclose to the wondering eyes of man. But the greatness in size of other stars or planets is small when compared with the Pleiades in importance, because the Pleiades is the place of the eternal throne of God."

    Mention of Pleiades is also in Creation 1927 p.94. This teaching was not discontinued until 1953.

    "Some attribute striking qualities to these constellations or star groups and on the basis of such they then offer private interpretations of Job 38:31, 32 that amaze their hearers when viewed scripturally they are completely without foundation.... Hence it is useless to indulge in unprofitable speculations. Incidentally, Pleiades can no longer be considered the center of the universe and it would be unwise for us to try to fix God's throne as being at a particular spot in the universe. Were we to think of the Pleiades as his throne we might improperly view with special veneration that cluster of stars" Watchtower 1953 Nov 15 p.703

    The Watchtower subtly blames the members, saying 'some attribute striking qualities', but does not refer to the fact that the reason the members had this belief was that it had been taught in Watchtower publications.

    http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/davinci-freemason.php

    arko_n9ne posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 05:48:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 77 of 93
    Joined 12/17/2011

    Thank you Blondie. As always, you're a fountain of knowledge.

    And I really mispelled "pleiades."

    therevealer posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 19:04:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 758 of 1086
    Joined 10/25/2010

    You could easily have gotten many more if people had the time to digest and reply. But your contribution was quite long and detailed and covered a subject that has been well covered. I am sure that many (of the 193) whom clicked on and read or skimmed it found it of interest but didn't elaborate.

    Band on the Run posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 20:11:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 3991 of 9598
    Joined 12/18/2010

    A friendly suggestion. Long posts, particularly copy and pasting someone else's work, drive me crazy. I'm interested in your thoughts. Perhaps a small summary of the article at the beginning would help. It prepares the reader for what is to follow. The reader can get the gist of your thread without reading it the article carefully.

    What drives me crazy is when people don't reveal the sources of the copy and paste jobs.

    I found the post interesting. Since was born-in, I always just accepted the WT speak. Now I can't believe the blatant propaganda and boasting. It reminds me of a totalitarian system, which it is.

    tiki posted Sat, 21 Jan 2012 22:45:00 GMT(1/21/2012)

    Post 126 of 1012
    Joined 9/27/2009

    Sayswho posted Wed, 07 Mar 2012 23:56:00 GMT(3/7/2012)

    Post 277 of 586
    Joined 4/25/2010

    Attending asRespectfulObservers

    Since they are not Jesus’ joint heirs with a heavenly hope, they attend the Memorial as respectful observers.—*Romans 6:3-5.

    Romans 6:3-5 Says:

    3 Or do YOU not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 Therefore we were buried with him through our baptism into his death, in order that, just as Christ was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, we also should likewise walk in a newness of life. 5 For if we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we shall certainly also be [united with him in the likeness] of his resurrection;


    • The scripture at Romans 6:3-5 does not back up the thought of us being there as observers!!! How does this go unquestioned...Oh I know but I just had to ask.
    • Show me one scripture where Jesus sent someone out and said: "go get believers and non believers to observe me making a covenant with you"...AND I WILL GO--respectfully.
    • We are intruders on this arrangement---uninvited guest--party crashers!

    Sw

    M processor posted Fri, 09 Mar 2012 09:10:00 GMT(3/9/2012)

    Post 302 of 818
    Joined 1/20/2008

    *wrong thread*

    Alfred posted Fri, 09 Mar 2012 13:00:00 GMT(3/9/2012)

    Post 838 of 954
    Joined 9/10/2010

    Paragraph 4 is implying that the Great Crowd cannot partake because they are in an "unclean state"...

    I guess the annointed are in a clean state?

    What does that even mean?

    designs posted Fri, 09 Mar 2012 13:09:00 GMT(3/9/2012)

    Post 9490 of 18633
    Joined 6/17/2009

    A 'christian' calling JW beliefs weird

    tornapart posted Fri, 09 Mar 2012 13:16:00 GMT(3/9/2012)

    Post 302 of 1815
    Joined 12/17/2011

    It's just a way of keeping the 'GC' in it's place, under control and out of the Kingdom of Heaven. They don't belong there because the 'Slave' said so.

    designs posted Fri, 09 Mar 2012 13:23:00 GMT(3/9/2012)

    Post 9492 of 18633
    Joined 6/17/2009

    When you get to Heaven be sure and write and send a pic

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