Question on Divorce when NOT scrip free.

Hope some light can be shed for me here :)

To cut a long story short, ex left me well over a year ago and filed divorce proceedings on me from another country. Was thrown out of court as the jurisdiction wasn't correct. Fast forward to today and I have now filed divorce and it will go through next month. I have not informed the elders. He attends meetings overseas. I attend meetings here (though infrequently). We have children together. He has not contacted us at all since leaving.

So, I am divorcing the *&#%$!!!* to put it nicely :)

My question is this: Can I be Disfellowshipped for divorcing him, given neither of us has committed adultery? (well, so he says, I don't believe him).

No you cannot be disfellowshipped for getting a divorce. You can only be disfellowshipped if you get remarried or commit adultery before he does. When Mat 19 is used the Watchtower puts the emphasis on the remarriage part.

Mat 19:9 I say to YOU that whoever divorces his wife, except on the ground of fornication, and marries another commits adultery.”

Thankyou for that :)

No, you won't get DF for getting divorced, but you will be if you bonk him after the divorce, even if you neither of you had been guilty of fornication.

"Pay Attention to Yourselves and to All the Flock" Page 135

A divorced couple (even if only legally divorced) who have sex relations with each other commit fornication. (Heb. 13:4; w82 9/lp.31)

Cheers

Chris

Lol fat chance of that happening. He's history as far as I'm concerned. But thanks for the clarification. I'd often wondered about that, whether if legally divorced are you still scripturally together. Kind of hypocritical isn't it? You're tied to them for life, if legally divorced but not scrip free. Yet though you're scrip tied, but legally div, you can't sleep with them. What the heck? What a joke. In other words, noone gets any sex! 

You can lose "privileges" like commenting at meetings, being on the school and auxilliary pioneering. That's what they did to me.

Hi WTL,

Personally, I don't hold any respect for the JWs elders, they are no more appointed by the Holy Spirit than the WT is "God's organisation" or pigs can fly.

Thus, to my mind what is it to do with them?

Anyhow, if you feel you need to play by the WT rules then here's an angle.

Yes, the words of Jesus seem pretty final, that said there see to be some other biblical reasons to allow divorce.

1 Timothy 5:8 (New International Version)

1 Corinthians 7:15 (New International Version)

  WANTSTOLEAVE- No, you can't be DFed for divorcing him . But one word of caution. If you are concerned about how the elders view you or your standing in the congregation and want to move on with your life in time and date others - DO NOT LET THE ELDERS KNOW or YOUR EX HUSBAND KNOW. If your ex or elders find out you are seeing other men and yet neither one of you had committed adultery ending the marriage in the WT societies eyes - they will haul your butt into a judicial meeting faster than you can blow your nose ! 

  I know- because this happened to me after my non-witness wife left me due to her drug addiction. I was going to coffee about 3 months after she left with a female friend to Starbucks - someone from the congregation saw me, then ratted me out to the elders. Immediately they hauled me in for a information finding judicial committee with 3 elders. For going to coffee with a woman friend as a seperated Jehovah's Witness.

  So think about what you want , be careful, pursue your freedom - but keep your personal life to yourself - it's none of the elders or your ex husbands business who you date. Good luck to you ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper

Dear WANTS TO LEAVE:

       Are your parents in "the truth"?  Are you close with your parents?  If so,  you'll want to become inactive for 6 months,  then slowly fade away.  I don't think they can DF you for leading a "worldly life" after you've become inactive.  Any former Elders want to comment on that?  I'm curious.   

Chuck

I think different congregations respond differently to divorcing. I knew a couple who were married for a couple years and had a child. They didn't get along very well and the exuse was they got married very young so it was okay to get a divorce. They divorced then the man remarried someone else shortly after being divorced. He and his new wife went to a different k.hall so they wouldn't run into his ex wife. No disfellowshipping for either partner and even when he got remarried he didn't get disfellowshipped. I will never understand the watchtower rules. I guess he just couldn't hold a microphone for a while as his punishment.

  CSP2033- Welcome to the board . I'm a former ministerial servant- not an elder - but was in the witnesses 44years. I can tell you for a fact if you get a hardcore elder body they will hunt and chase you down no matter HOW LONG you have been inactive if they smell you possibly committing a DFing offense. I was inactive and not attending for three and a half years - even moved to a different area- and they hunted me down like a dog. So it depends if someone wants to cause you pain or not- if they do they'll come after ya.  Peace out, Mr. Flipper

Thanks everyone :)

Bluecanary: If I were to lose 'privleges' like answering up, then I would've been reproved by them right? That would be the last straw for me, and I'd tell them to shove it. Simply because I am divorcing primarily for financial safety, as ex has a substantial amount of debt that I do not want to be responsible for. Thank for pointing that possibility out though :)

Flipper: Thankfully my ex is in another country but I know he tries to keep tabs on me. Not quite sure how, other than his friends (non JW) that live in my area. Even then, I've had nothing to hide. I have dirt on him on the other hand, which I took to the elders, and they told me 'pity we hadn't known this sooner, nothing we can do about it now'. I stood there with my mouth open, like pardon??!?! I'd only just gotten this 'dirt', so how could I have told them sooner! 

CSP: Yes, am close to my parents who are also JW's. I have a brother who is a fader of 5yrs now. Noone elder wise has pursued him, even though when they see him they are polite and say hello.

Keeshondgirl: Wow, funny situation. I wonder if there was some private reproof there? I thought in case likes that though, where everyone sees the divorce and remarriage, that it would have to be public reproof? Interesting.

Chalam: Thanks. I'll definitely bring those scriptures up. It has been a hard slog for me supporting 2 children on my own, but I've managed. I could use the scripture in such a way that shows how he isn't even supporting them emotionally and spiritually as supposed to as well. 

I personally think he's biding his time. He is waiting for me to make the mistake first, then he can play the card of him being the victim in this and 'my wife cheated', even though it was he who abandoned us. I don't think I'm ready to give him that satisfaction yet. 

Yep, that would be reproval. And I got divorced for the same reason you are. I don't know what country you are in, but in the US there's no getting away from debt your spouse incurred. Learned THAT the hard way.

Wantstoleave, do you want to leave the Organization too? If so, keep your mouth shut, don't tell the elders anything and then leave.

Thanks Bluecanary :) I'm not in the US....but he has gone back there. I spoke to legal people here and they told me I needed to divorce him in case he is running up more debt back in the states.

Minimus, yes I want to leave. I was talking to my mum about the divorce today. I told her that apparently I can be reproved for doing it. She said that if I was, to take it on the chin but reiterate to the elders WHY I divorced him (financial reasons) but then suck it up and take the reproof. I got a bit huffy and told her no way would I accept reproof when I'd done nothing wrong. She got a bit annoyed with me, because I am sure she senses she is losing me 'to the world'. She told me not to think like that, then I added that I'd tell the elders to get lost, that it's MY life. Then I told her I didn't want to talk about it anymore. It was left at that. 

Be careful what you tell mum. She may not be able to deal with it.

If the only issue is divorcing your husband, there is no official basis for reproof.  The grounds for reproof are the same as for df'ing except the elders on the JC have found the person "repentant." 

*** w56 10/1 p. 597 par. 39 Marriage Obligations and Divorce ***. It cannot excommunicate any member just for divorcing on unscriptural grounds, but if that member remarries before the death or immorality of the divorced mate, the congregation would disfellowship this member for adulterous remarriage.

*** jv chap. 13 p. 177 Recognized by Our Conduct ***While the Scriptures do not direct that everyone obtaining a divorce be expelled from the congregation, those who also commit adultery and are unrepentant are disfellowshipped by the congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses.—1 Cor. 6:9, 10.

Thanks for the research Blondie :) You're a wealth of information. Are you still 'in', or fading or out?

Out, no meetings for over 8 years.

Hi WTS,

I agree, don't give him the satisfaction. He has left so let him do the accounting.

Divorce means separation which is un-scriptural for a married couple Matthew 19:6 He has separated from you 1 Corinthians 7:10-11

If you check the Greek for that verse 7-11.htm the word used means literally "lay aside" which means leave alone, abandon, divorce, leave, neglect etc.

He has done that and has broken what God has commanded not to be broken and is in a state of unbelief.

So what's his current status?

All the best,

Stephen