What is "PRESENT" truth? Who understands the Greek ?

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    hamsterbait posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 18:15:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Joined 7/7/2004

    I dont know greek, but cant help wondering what the word "PRESENT" in that phrase means.

    The Borg uses it to mean "what we tell you at this time is true".

    I wonder if it means present in the sense of somebody you know being present in the room with you.

    "the truth present in our lives" "the truth that is here with us".

    Just wondering....

    HB

    Matsimus posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 18:22:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Joined 2/21/2012

    Sorry, I don't know. One of the big problems with translating old texts is that some words have many different meanings in different contexts. Here in Norway some words even have a completely different meaning depending on how you pronounce them. Talk about being harsh on immigrants trying to learn the language :p

    Matsimus

    F blondie posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 18:35:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

    Post 33438 of 37613
    Joined 5/28/2001

    What is Present Truth?

    To be established in the Truth signifies that we have carefully studied and thoroughly proved it by the law and the testimony (Isa. 8:20),' and that as a consequence we are convinced of its accuracy, so that our faith is steadfast and immovable: we know whom we have believed; we have tasted and seen that the Lord is good; we have partaken of his spirit of meekness, faith and godliness to such an extent as to be led into a joyful realization of the fullness of his grace as manifested in the wonderful Divine Plan of the Ages; and we have been permitted to see, not only the various features of that plan, but also the necessity and reasonableness of all its various measures in order to the full accomplishment of its glorious outcome in the fullness of the appointed times. This is what it is to be 'established in the Present Truth." It is indeed a most blessed condition, bringing with it such peace and joy as the world can neither give nor take away.

    and

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/186897/1/What-is-Present-Truth

    - C.T. Russell

    M Terry posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 00:12:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

    Post 12560 of 16489
    Joined 6/19/2004

    Another absorbed teaching from the 7th Day Adventists

    Present Truth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Present_Truth

    Present Truth. From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Jump to: navigation, search. "Present Truth" may refer to any of the following: In the Seventh-day Adventist...

    M NeonMadman posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 01:40:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

    Post 3599 of 3677
    Joined 6/4/2001

    I just ran a search on the phrase in a number of different Bible translations. It does not appear in most modern Bible translations at all, and that includes the NWT. It does appear at 2 Peter 1:12 in the KJV and the New King James. Other translations render the verse in a way that does not imply 'the truth at the present time,' but seem to refer to the truth being present in Christians.

    The NASB, for example, reads, "Therefore, I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you already know them, and have been established in the truth which is present with you."

    The ESV (English Standard Version) reads: "Therefore I intend always to remind you of these qualities, though you know them and are established in the truth that you have."

    Even the NWT reads, "For this reason I shall be disposed always to remind YOU of these things, although YOU know [them] and are firmly set in the truth that is present [in YOU]."

    Clearly the emphasis of the verse is on the truth being present in believers, and not on the believers' having to keep up with ever-changing versions of the truth.

    Phizzy posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 13:22:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

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    Joined 12/17/2011

    It seems then that the Bible writers knew that Truth does not change, someone really ought to tell the WT you know.

    Wonderment posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:37:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

    Post 205 of 345
    Joined 11/29/2009

    The Greek expression for "present truth" is: te paroúse aletheía, which can be translated literally as: the being beside truth; the being present truth; the present truth.

    The second word in the Gr. expression paroúse is related to parousía which we being taught in the KH that it means "presence." Both paroúse and parousía are related to páreimi which basically means, (from pará, beside and eimí, be). Various versions below can help us understand the expression:

    ISV: Therefore, I intend to keep on reminding you about these things, even though you already know them and are firmly established in the truth that you now have.

    Darby: Wherefore I will be careful to put you always in mind of these things, although knowing them and established in the present truth.

    Weymouth: For this reason I shall always persist in reminding you of these things, although you know them and are stedfast believers in truth which you already possess.

    Young's: Wherefore, I will not be careless always to remind you concerning these things, though, having known them, and having been established in the present truth,

    NSB: I will always be ready to remind you of these things. Even though you know them, and are established in the truth that is present with you.

    21st Cent: "...in the truth as presently revealed."

    Twentieth Cent: "...in the Truth that you now hold."

    Vincent's Word Studies: In the present truth (ε?ν τη?? παρου´ση? α?ληθει´α?)

    i.e., the truth which is present with you through the instruction of your teachers; not the truth at present under consideration. See on 2 Peter 1:9; and compare the same phrase in Colossians 1:6, rendered, is come unto you.

    Barnes' Notes: And be established in the present truth - That is, the truth which is with you, or which you have received - Robinson's Lexicon on the word πα´ρειμι pareimi. The apostle did not doubt that they were now confirmed in the truth as far as it had been made known to them, but he felt that amidst their trials, and especially as they were liable to be drawn away by false teachers, there was need of reminding them of the grounds on which the truths which they had embraced rested, and of adding his own testimony to confirm their Divine origin. Though we may be very firm in our belief of the truth, yet there is a propriety that the grounds of our faith should be stated to us frequently, that they may be always in our remembrance. The mere fact that at present we are firm in the belief of the truth, is no certain evidence that we shall always continue to be; nor because we are thus firm should we deem it improper for our religious teachers to state the grounds on which our faith rests, or to guard us against the arts of those who would attempt to subvert our faith.

    Leolaia posted Fri, 23 Mar 2012 02:41:00 GMT(3/23/2012)

    Post 16251 of 16234
    Joined 9/1/2002

    Here is an example of the Society using the expression "present truth" to refer to the changing nature of their faith, which needs to be kept "up to date":

    *** re chap. 1 p. 8 par. 8 Revelation—Its Happy Climax! ***

    An even stronger reason for publishing this book is the need to keep up-to-date with present truth. Jehovah is continually shedding greater light on the meaning of his Word, and we can expect that our understanding of Revelation, along with other prophecies, will be sharpened as we draw closer to the great tribulation. (Matthew 24:21; Revelation 7:14)

    Another example is the statement in the Watchtower criticizing those who "do not see the light of present truth and ... insist on holding to the truths, and to those truths only, which he learned years ago; and they refuse to recognize the fact that God, through Christ, reveals his truth to his church in a progressive manner and in his due time... For this reason they do not understand and appreciate present truth" (1 August 1928 Watchtower, p. 230).

    What is interesting about this is quite contrary to the meaning in 2 Peter 1:12, the source of this expression. The sense is not temporal ("the truth that is presently held by us") but locative ("the truth that is present among you"), and the Society is aware of this too when they comment on this verse. It is worth examining the rhetorical function of this expression (parousè alètheia) in its context in 2 Peter. The whole epistle is concerned with apostasy in the proto-orthodox church after the death of the apostles. This involved both moral corruption (the subject of the lengthy parenetic survey of history in ch. 2) and loss of faith in the parousia and eschatological judgment (ch. 3). The epistle also plagiarizes extensively from Jude; essentially the letter rewrites Jude to address the needs of the current post-apostolic generation and puts the message into the mouth of Peter who was not only one of the Twelve but who was viewed as the "rock" of the apostolic church in the Matthean community. The author writes the letter as a "last will and testament" of Peter shortly before his death (v. 13-15) to remind his readers of the "true" apostolic faith: "I want you to recall the words spoken in the past by the holy prophets and the command given by our Lord and Savior through your apostles" (3:2). That is what the letter is supposed to be: a permanent reminder from the apostles to never stray from the faith they promulgated (hence the pseudonymity in the letter, such as in v. 1, 14, 16-17 in ch. 1). And so "Peter" writes: "I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body, because I know that I will soon put it aside, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things" (v. 13-14). The letter is the very means through which "Peter" makes his effort to make the church "always be able to remember these things" after his departure, i.e. after his death. And so in the verse that originated the expression "present truth", the author in the guise of Peter states: "So I will always remind you of these things, even though you know them and are firmly established in the truth you now have (lit., in the truth present among you)" (v. 12). Thanks to this letter, Peter will always be able to give a reminder to the church of their original faith, even after he is dead and buried. So the whole point of the expression is to emphasize the permanence of the truth, its fixity and unchanging nature; it was what Christians are "firmly established" in. And this included a rejection of newer reinterpretation of prophecy by those who aren't inspired (v. 20-21). Also, since 2 Peter copies a large portion of Jude, it is worthwhile examining how the author has adapted his source in this passage. The source is this statement:

    "Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt compelled to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to God’s holy people. For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord" (Jude 3-4).

    The "truth that is present among you" corresponds to the "faith that was once and for all entrusted to God's holy people". This similarly conveys the image of the faith as already entrusted to the church by the apostles; it isn't something that still has to be revealed to God's holy people. It is also interesting that the author of Jude, in turn, was likely dependent on another source for this expression; he was probably inspired by the reference in the Assumption of Moses to "the faith first laid down for them" (4:8). We know that he used this work (also a pseudonymous "last will and testament"), as he quotes directly from it in v. 9. In his editing of the material, the author of 2 Peter eliminated Jude's quotations from parabiblical writings (including the citation of 1 Enoch 1:9 in v. 14-15).

    Wonderment posted Fri, 23 Mar 2012 04:54:00 GMT(3/23/2012)

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    Joined 11/29/2009

    Thank you Leolaia for the excellent summary!

    hamsterbait posted Fri, 23 Mar 2012 13:30:00 GMT(3/23/2012)

    Post 3925 of 4887
    Joined 7/7/2004

    Thank you Lion(ess) Of Wisdom!

    HB

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