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UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS

DannyHaszard

UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Fri, 10 Jun 2005 00:24:00 GMT (6/10/2005)

Maine

Post 237 of 5120
Since 5/6/2005

{Such a law would cut both ways.The Watchtower spews and slings hate.}

Religious hate law would protect witches and cults

Independent, UK - 27 minutes ago

... Correspondent. Satanists, witches and cult members will be protected by controversial new laws banning incitement to religious hatred. ...

By Nigel Morris, Home Affairs Correspondent

10 June 2005

Satanists, witches and cult members will be protected by controversial new laws banning incitement to religious hatred.

The legislation, which has twice been abandoned in the face of resistance from opposition parties, writers and comedians who argue it threatens free speech, is designed to protect Muslims from extreme prejudice.

But as it launched a fresh attempt to drive the law on to the statute book, the Government said the law would carry a wide-ranging definition of religion. Officials confirmed it could include satanists, pagans and religious sects. The Racial and Religious Hatred Bill will also cover people defined by their lack of faith, such as atheists and humanists.

Only one or two prosecutions a year are expected under the law, which will carry a maximum jail sentence of seven years, but ministers argue that it will send out a powerful message that inciting racial hatred will not be tolerated.

The Home Office minister Paul Goggins insisted that riots might not have broken out in northern towns such as Oldham and Bradford in 2001 had such legislation been in place. He said the new criminal offence would be very tightly drawn and would not outlaw comedians' jokes, criticism of religion or provocative commentary on religion.

"People will say offensive things, people will put on offensive plays and there may be literature that causes offence. But the test is: 'Does this incite hatred in another person?'"

Mr Goggins added: "This will be a line in the sand which indicates to people a line beyond which they cannot go. People of all backgrounds and faiths have a right to live free from hatred, racism and extremism."

The proposed measure covers comments made in speeches and other public appearances, media interviews and articles. It puts Muslims on the same footing as Jews and Sikhs, who are covered by race-hate legislation.

The Government had to give up its first attempt to bring in laws against religious hatred in 2002 because of fierce opposition in the Lords. A second effort was abandoned when time ran out before the general election.

Labour promised the measure in its election manifesto and the Government has said it is prepared to use the Parliament Act to force it into law.

It has been backed by the Muslim Council of Britain and police chiefs.

The actor and writerStephen Fry told Radio 4's PM programme that the Bill was "rather shaming" and "an embarrassment to the statute book".

"It just suggests it's not a thought-through or needed piece of legislation," he said. "It is something to please communities."

The author Salman Rushdie has complained that the measure would "sacrifice freedom of speech in order to placate Muslim voters".

Shami Chakrabarti, director of Liberty, said: "This offence is capable of catching attacks on ideas as well as people.

"At best this is an empty sop to a community sorely let down by government. At worst it is a dangerous new blasphemy law out of step with our best traditions." David Davis, the shadow Home Secretary, said the law would be "massively counter-productive" and "seriously undermine freedom of speech". He said: "Religion, unlike race, is a matter of personal choice and therefore appropriate for open debate."

Gadget

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Fri, 10 Jun 2005 09:56:00 GMT (6/10/2005)

England, Tyne and Wear

Post 2462 of 2838
Since 5/25/2003

I fail to see the problem with the law protecting witches..............

I this will turn out just lke the much hyped human rights act - very good in principle, but in practice doesn't make a difference to those who it was meant to protect and widely abused to the point it has become a laughing stock. At work we have to virtually jump through hoops so we don't infringe the human rights of the mass rapists, child molesters, and murderers we have locked up there.

And the fact they are considering using the parlimentary act to bring it in shows to me just how out of touch with the general public this government is. I might be wrong, but I think it has only been used once to force through a law in the 40s or 50s, except for this current government who seem to threaten to use it quite a bit.

I don't think this new law would be neccesary if the powers that be enforced the current laws, but thats the way they fix every problem - just make a new law.

Sirona

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Fri, 10 Jun 2005 10:02:00 GMT (6/10/2005)

England, Greater Manchester

Post 3425 of 5269
Since 10/10/2001

I for one think that an article which is insinuating that Satanists, Witches and Cult members should NOT be protected from hate is disgusting!

The people in those groups should be protected from hatred just like the people in other groups should be! This doesn't mean that we can't talk about the Jehovahs Witnesses and we can't expose the doctrinal errors, it just means that if we form a team and perform hate crimes against them it won't be tolerated.

You know, it really gets on my nerves when people (ignorant people) suggest that Witches and Satanists are evil people.

Sirona

rick1199

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Fri, 10 Jun 2005 11:53:00 GMT (6/10/2005)

England

Post 65 of 89
Since 2/20/2004

Could I prosecute the eldars for insiting relious hated agaist me for being an Agnostic ?

Crumpet

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Fri, 10 Jun 2005 11:56:00 GMT (6/10/2005)

Post 816 of 7260
Since 10/21/2004

What an interesting thought - could we sue them for religious hatred re their DFing policy? Bring it to the forefront of public attention.

I wonder if it does get passed how they will regard it in the light of their Great Tribulation theory where all religions will be wiped out by the governments and UN? hmm

diamondblue1974

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Thu, 16 Jun 2005 13:34:00 GMT (6/16/2005)

England, Greater Manchester

Post 777 of 3508
Since 2/1/2005

Good point Sirona.

As the law has not yet been passed there will no doubt be a number of ammendments to the proposed bill and hopefully a half decent piece of legislation would be passed (however not holding my breath on this one) however the question will always be about where the line is drawn between open and public criticism and inciting religious hatred. We can but wait and see.

DB74

Abaddon

Re: UK Religious HATE LAW would PROTECT witches and CULTS posted Thu, 16 Jun 2005 14:02:00 GMT (6/16/2005)

Post 4270 of 5862
Since 4/6/2001

This law is in no way intended to stop humour, criticism or comment (it's been stated so many times by the government it's getting monotonous). It is just meant to allow people who incite others to break the law out of hate towards another religious group to be brought to justice, just as someone who incited others to break the law out of greed would be brought to justice.

If trying to convince someone to rob a bank is illegal, I think trying to convince someone to give a Muslim a kicking should be illegal too.

Under current laws it is illegal to say 'Jews are evil criminals, kill them', or 'Seikhs are evil criminals, kill them', as in law their religions are held to be racial in identity.

This is silly. I could become a Jew or a Seikh, and Jews come from a variety of racial groups in any case. If offers those two religions protection more racially diverse faith have, and is thus unfair.

All this law does is extend the same protection Jews and Seikhs have to other faiths, and extend the same responsibility for inciting breaking the law on grounds of religious hate as already exisst for inciting breaking the law on other grounds.

The most important thing to remember is that ONLY the Attorney General can bring prosecutions under this law. The Attorney General is not some political whore courting votes by high-profile but fanciful prosecutions - it's an appointed postion.

Thus this law will be used a few times a year at most, when it really applies. Fred Bigot and Majhid Fundy will not be able to file charges themselves if they some joke or newspaper article upsets them; the chief lawyer in the country will have to feel there is a case.

I'm astounded at how the news coverage can distort something so simple obvious and needed.

Just as an example, this;

"Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine of refusing transfusions of whole blood even if this risks death is not considered Biblically sound by most scholars. The doctrine is also regarded by most medical people as being incomprehensible and illogical, as (for example) plasma (almost all water) is not allowed, whilst blood fractions (that are 100% blood) is allowed. The most worrying factor is that the ill person cannot exercise their conscience freely, as any Witness accepting whole blood transfusions will be shunned by most if not all the Jehovah's Witnesses they know."

... would not fall under the new legislation. It is all factual, supportable, demonstrable, and doesn't seek to incite hate towards people on grounds of their religion.

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