Today's Watchtower Lesson Really Bothered Me...

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    dontplaceliterature posted Sun, 25 Sep 2011 23:55:00 GMT(9/25/2011)

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    I was a hair away from telling my wife I never wanted to go to the Kingdom Hall again after today's Watchtower. :/

    The conductor mentioned something along the lines of..."If you think having to shun your disfellowshipped children is bad...you should read up on the Israelites. When one of their children was disobedient to the law, they had to take the before the Judges so that they could be stoned to death...and guess who's job it was throw the first stone?"

    What an ass.

    There was a couple sitting behind me who have a disfellowshipped 18 YR old living in their house. I'm sure that made their skin crawl.

    Any other interesting comments to report from today's lesson?

    MrFreeze posted Sun, 25 Sep 2011 23:56:00 GMT(9/25/2011)

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    I don't go to meetings anymore but even as someone who believed what the WT said, I could never justify shunning in my mind.

    White Dove posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:04:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    DISGUSTING ASSHOLES!

    That's all I have to say about that.

    designs posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:11:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    And you wonder why the Courts around the world are bringing pressure on the Watchtower and its 'Family Values' positions.

    jay88 posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:24:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    I was bothered throughout the whole thing myself, until I finally burned out, and just checked out on it all.

    What got me started was this statement:

    The "slave class" is more interested in cooperating with God's unfolding purpose than in shielding itself from criticism over an adjusted understanding. How do you react when an adjustment in our understanding of the Scriptures is presented?

    WTF.

    finallysomepride posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:29:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    what a wanker, so glad I don't go any more

    N.drew posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:43:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    An elder usually conducts the Watchtower study, right? An elder should know the Bible. He probably was referencing Deuteronomy 21:18-20. He is applying it to disfellowshipped ones???? What the scripture means is the adult child in the household is causing the parents grief over a long period of time "he will not obey our voice". It says he is a glutton (which means to shake as in the wind-my take is it means the parents are affected to the point of shaking) and he is a drunkuen (adults drink). So now you have a contentious drinker in the house disrupting the peace of the household, he won't stop. Then he gets taken to the elders of the city, now here, I'm sure he can get scared to repent, so it's not over yet. If the rebel does not smarten up at this point he is stoned "by the men of the city". I do not know where it is written that the parents are to throw the first stone, really it does not say that the parents throw any stone.

    My conclusion is the scene only occurs when things get so bad for the others in the house, that it becomes it's him or us.

    So, in case someone is dis-fellowshipped and is quietly waiting for grace, (has anyone ever notice how good dis-fellowshipped ones are?), I think this is the last scripture to apply to them. And the brother who said mommy should throw the first stone should be damned. Amen

    Leolaia posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 00:51:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    "When one of their children was disobedient to the law, they had to take the before the Judges so that they could be stoned to death...and guess who's job it was throw the first stone?"

    Heh. Well what was the lesson in ch. 8 of John?

    "He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone" (John 8:7).

    Since the speaker made the connection to stoning, then the same lesson applies: He who is without sin among you, let him be for the first to shun their disfellowshipped child.

    Anyone in the congregation can make that claim?

    clarity posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:05:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Way to go watchtower!

    Now all your young sons and daughters know for sure that your so called love is not special, they're not loved for who they are, mom & dad's love is conditional!

    Mommy, daddy, all the elders & jehovah only love little johnny IF ................ they think and act like everybody else at the kh!

    Is it any wonder that the kids are depressed!!!

    This society is so blood guilty ... suicide rate of jw youths is high!

    We let them die as babies by withholding medical treatment, then we make them carry around a suicide card in their wallets. Then the minute they rebel as youths do .... we totally abandon them ...... SHUN them!!!

    I have hate tonight.

    clarity

    edited to add: when are you jw parents going to STICK-UP for your kids, instead of bowing to whims of those gangsters??

    You are idolaters!!!

    edited again: SHAME on you, for shunning your flesh and blood!

    N.drew posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:09:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    clarity

    AnneB posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:12:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Has it ever crossed their minds that Israel was a special people bred to serve a certain purpose for God? They weren't told to drag non-Israelites to the stoning ground! We're not Israelites, not even those who claim these days to be Jews can say they are under the arrangement from back then ('cause none of them live it fully).

    Apples and oranges.

    AB

    transhuman68 posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:44:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    The Witnesses are on the lunatic fringe of Christianity. Forcing parents to shun their children in the name of their bronze-age imaginary god is evidence of that; and believing that ancient middle eastern practices set a precedent- it all just screams- 'cult.'

    N.drew posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:48:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    AnneB You are right. My theory is 2 Peter 3: 3,4 says mockers with their mockery will come according to their own desires (eagerness for-epithumia). What they are mocking is the Bible. Do they not imitate it where it does not apply and do they not twist scriptures to fit their own understanding? Also the same word "eagerness for" is found at 2 Timothy 4:3 where it says "according to their own desires (eagerness for-epithumias) they will accumulate teachers for themselves. We see that all the time, brothers put up in positions of leadership who do not know the Bible.

    Who do we know that is a body that can be identified by what is with them? Mockers with their mockery.

    M darth frosty posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 01:58:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Actually AnneB whats really said is the fact the Law of moses DIED with Jesus but every chance the WT gets they resurect its archaic principles to suit there needs.

    EmptyInside posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 02:04:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Well,I've heard more than once,imagine how Jehovah feels when the angels,including Satan,rebelled against Him. So,they go on to say that Jehovah understands what parents with disfellowshipped children have to go through,because He deals with it Himself. And He will eventually destroy Satan and his demons,former sons.

    But,again,how can they compare heavenly spirit creatures,to young people raised in the religion.

    I bet if most Witnesses heard of other religions having the same sort of shunning policy,they would think it was just terrible. But,they are the exception to any rule,since they have the "truth".

    (OT) I watched a movie once with my Witness mother. It was the usual type of movie where the family of the girl doesn't approve of the man she loves because he comes from a different background. My mother,of course,was all for the young couple to be together. And thought the family was foolish to keep the couple apart on such a matter. But,I could see for a split second,that she was comparing it to me,being with an unbeliever. And silence from her for the rest of the movie.

    Maybe reasoning on non-Witness examples, can help them see how foolish the Watchtower policies are.

    Quarterback posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 02:12:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Jehovah, doesn't even disfellowship in his Kingdom. He allowed, Satan and the rebellious sons to exist in the Heavens. They had a free voice, as it says in the first chapter of Job. Eventually, he had them removed, but did deal with them and not shun them. Jesus did have discussions with Satan and so called Rebellious Angels, while he was here on earth. Was that Necessary Business?

    EmptyInside posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 02:32:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Yeah,evidently,it was necessary family business,lol.

    F Odrade posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 04:09:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    I hope they continue to make proclamations like this. The more heinous statements they make out loud, the more people will be shocked into waking up and leaving.

    lostandconfused posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 04:12:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    It was disgusting. I was bothered too. Our speaker emphasized on how this is such a LOVING thing to do and "Oh, surely the parents of the disfellowshipped one are the ones that hurt the most"...Then followed all the comments, one sister about having to shun her disfellowshipped daughter, then another brother about having to shun his disfellowshipped father. "Surely this is done for love so they realize they need to be in Jehovah's organization."

    What really bothered me is they went on and on today about how these "disfellowshipped" ones are all fornicators, idolaters, and drunkerds...

    How many people who get disfellowshipped simply decided not to believe the WTBTS docrines anymore or chose a different religion? They are not all gross sinners! The hypocrisy angers me...it took all I could not to get up and leave today, or even worse...raise my hand and comment on what my opinion was! UGH....Can't wait to get out!!

    lostandconfused posted Mon, 26 Sep 2011 04:14:00 GMT(9/26/2011)

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    Odrade- I doubt it. You would think so right? It seems like the more ridiculous they become, the more their followers just nod their heads and agree...

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