NEED HELP: ARTICLES ABOUT JWS VS SHRINKS

I need quotes from articles they have written about how much they hate and distrust shrinks and how they believe shrinks are trying to blame JWs depression on their religions.

I know you guys got the goods...my husband and I are in family therapy with a counselor and I believe he is blowing smoke up her ass, telling her what he thinks she wants to hear to get the hell out of there. I want to show her that she cannot believe everything he says and that the JWs as they are in COURT, are disingenuous and liars in front of psychiatrists.

thanks.

PS He announced to her in front of our son, that not only doesnt he love me now but he NEVER loved me...that he said to me while we were courting what he thought I wanted to hear. That he didnt want to marry me but did so because he said he would and felt obligated.  So for 22 years, I have lived in a loveless marriage with a man who didnt even love me BEFORE we were married. He has ripped my heart out....and stomped on it.

I know you guys got the goods...my husband and I are in family therapy with a counselor and I believe he is blowing smoke up her ass, telling her what he thinks she wants to hear to get the hell out of there. I want to show her that she cannot believe everything he says and that the JWs as they are in COURT, are disingenuous and liars in front of psychiatrists.

thanks.

PS He announced to her in front of our son, that not only doesnt he love me now but he NEVER loved me...that he said to me while we were courting what he thought I wanted to hear. That he didnt want to marry me but did so because he said he would and felt obligated. So for 22 years, I have lived in a loveless marriage with a man who didnt even love me BEFORE we were married. He has ripped my heart out....and stomped on it.

If he keeps making comments like that, the counselor should be able to figure out that your husband has a pattern of blowing smoke.

Also, you may want to Google Dr. Jerry Bergman.

Good luck, and so sorry that your husband is an A**HOLE!

He announced to her in front of our son, that not only doesnt he love me now but he NEVER loved me.

I'm so sorry that happened to you.  That was a cruelty you did not deserve. 

I have been out of the WT for many years now and don't remember any articles that indicated a distrust for psychologists when I was in.  However, I agree with the above poster that she will see the situation for what it is.  Sadly, so will your son.  An announcement like your husband made does nothing to engender respect for him from anyone who hears it.

I wish you the best during this difficult time.

Oh....you guys are so nice.

Am I crazy??  Did I not remember correctly?  MARY!!! Help girl!  I know you know what Im talking about.  Or was that just another urban legend that we all got sucked into? That if you are depressed and you go to a worldly shrink they will try to convince you its your religion and try to "separate you from Jehovah?"

Hello Wuzluvsdubs..My heartfelt sympathy for all that you are going through 

However, as somebody said, I think that your issues are personal with Mr, rather than the WTS.

Certainly in the past, perhaps 50 or more years ago they used to attack psychiatry as a pseudo science that did more harm than good. But in recent years any article on depression or mental illness has said that professional mental health care may be necessary. They have not knocked it for decades.

Certainly in my family loyal dubs have consulted psychologists and psychiatrists without any faith related issues. 

MARY!!! Help girl!  I know you know what Im talking about.  Or was that just another urban legend that we all got sucked into? That if you are depressed and you go to a worldly shrink they will try to convince you its your religion and try to "separate you from Jehovah?"

Ask and ye shall receive:

"... As a rule, for a Christian to go to a worldly psychiatrist is an admission of defeat. It amounts to 'going down to Egypt for help' - Isaiah 31:1. ...Also, more and more psychiatrists are resorting to hypnosis which is a demonic form of worldly wisdom." (Awake!1960 March 8 p. 27)

Does the Solution Lie with Psychiatrists?

PSYCHOTHERAPY is the art of trying to help mentally or emotionally disturbed persons by listening to their problems, and endeavoring to offer them insight to cope with these problems. Psychiatrists-persons who employ this form of treatment-have increased sevenfold in number in the United States during the past twenty-five years.

The most popular psychiatric approach has been that of Sigmund Freud's psychoanalytical "couch" theory. Its use, however, has been chiefly in the United States. Thus New York city, with nine million inhabitants, has almost a thousand psychoanalysts, whereas Tokyo, with eleven million people, has but three!

The value of psychiatric treatment is by no means universally recognized. In fact, even the director of the United States National Institute for the Psychotherapies recently spoke of the "controversy and frequent disillusionment that currently characterize the field of psychotherapy." Also, psychiatrist Karl Menninger observed: "Nine tenths of people with so called schizophrenia get well without going near a hospital."

In an especially strong indictment, Dr. H. J. Eysenck of the Institute of Psychiatry, University of London, wrote in the Medical Tribune of April 4, 1973, that the result "claimed for different methods of psychotherapy and psychoanalysis was almost exactly that found for spontaneous remission." In other words, according to Eysenck, persons receiving psychiatric help had about the same recovery rate as those receiving no psychiatric treatment at all!

Help Provided

However, it cannot be denied that some persons have received genuine help from psychiatrists. A man in California writes: "The help I received from that kind man was extremely beneficial, and my problem was resolved quickly." Posing the question, "What did this psychiatrist do for me?" he answered: "He listened. He really listened. . . . he helped me to realize that within myself I had the ability to develop self-control."

This disturbed man had a behavioral problem, one that evidenced a serious sexual aberration. But through kindness and encouragement the psychiatrist helped him to correct his weakness. Even extreme cases have responded to such psychiatric treatment. Giving pertinent testimony along this line is a case history described in The Vital Balance, authored by a team headed by Karl Menninger.

The case is that of "Mary Smith," who, at the age of sixty-three, was admitted to a state hospital. Somehow she had gotten the idea that her husband, a kind, gentle, typical farmer, was involved in illegal liquor traffic and that he had repeatedly tried to poison her. So she had attacked him with a hammer while he was sleeping.

She was diagnosed as "disturbed, restless and confused." Six years after her admission she was judged incurably insane. Seven more years passed, and a new doctor came along who took an interest in her. He patiently listened to her strident complaints, sympathized and agreed with her whenever he could. He took walks with her, tactfully helping her to clear up some of her delusions. He had glasses fitted for her, and had the nurse give her things to read, as well as to chat with her.

Gradually the tone of her voice changed, she became helpful in making beds, and was permitted to go walking on the grounds by herself. Soon she was allowed to be away for a few days. Then, at the age of seventy-six, she obtained a position as a practical nurse, caring for an elderly woman. Years later her daughter reported regarding her: "She is an excellent worker, helpful and cooperative . . . one of the best-organized women I ever knew at any age."

Such successes in helping the mentally disturbed point to the type of treatment they especially need. Sir Geoffrey Vickers, as chairman of the Mental Health Research Fund, years ago explained: "By far the most significant discovery of mental science is the power of love to protect and restore the mind."

Yes, love, kindness, patience and understanding are now generally recognized as vital in the successful treatment of mental patients. Yet, as noted earlier, psychiatrists often fail to help patients recover. Is there some fundamental reason why?

Basic Failure in Approach

It has well been observed that people need to know the reason for their existence, what purpose there is to life, so as to have strength to endure in the face of tragedy. But are psychiatrists best able to provide this? Can they help people to answer the basic questions about which they wonder, such as: "Why am I here?" "What is life all about?" "What destiny awaits me?"

The truth is that, not any human, but only the Creator of humankind, Almighty God, can provide sound, satisfying answers to these questions. And he has done so for our hope and comfort in his Word the Bible. But how do psychiatrists generally feel about God?

A 1970 survey indicates how. Of the psychiatrists interviewed, 55 percent said that they considered belief in God to be "infantile," and "incongruous with reality."

What an unreasonable, illogical conclusion! For think: How else can we explain the origin of life if we leave out the existence of a supreme God? Or what about love-from where does this marvelous quality come that is so vital to mental health? Only the Bible's explanation is both reasonable and logical. And its explanation is that a supreme, loving Creator is responsible. (Ps. 36:9; 1 John 4: 8-11) Prominent men of science, who were by no means "infantile," have expressed belief in such a God.

Science Digest says of one of these: "Most historians of science would declare at once that Isaac Newton was the greatest scientific mind the world has ever seen." And in his masterpiece, Principia, Newton said: "From his true dominion it follows that the true God is a living, intelligent, and powerful Being; and, from his other perfections, that he is supreme, or most perfect. He is eternal and infinite, omnipotent and omniscient."

The basic failure of worldly psychiatrists is that generally they do not look to this true God for wisdom and guidance in treating the emotionally and mentally disturbed. And undoubtedly one of the consequences of their attitude is that they themselves have the highest suicide rate among all those in the medical specialities! Regarding this, one of their own number says: ‘Until psychiatrists have the lowest rate, all their teachings are subject to suspicion.'-Journal of the American Medical Association.

Further Effects of Basic Failure

Failing to recognize the sound instruction of God's Word, psychiatrists seldom apply love in a balanced way. For example, in one case a father who was unable to wean his teen-age son away from drugs sent him to a psychiatrist. With what results? The father wound up $2,000 poorer and the son had not changed in the slightest.

The father wanted to help his son. However, neither he nor the psychiatrist appreciated the teaching of God's Word, namely, that firm, yet kind, discipline is a vital part of the exercise of love. (Heb. 12:6-9; Prov. 23:13, 14) Finally, listening to sound counsel, the father ordered his son out of the house until he was willing to go to a drug rehabilitation center. Later the son told his father: "You know, when you and Mom threw me out, that's when I knew you really wanted to help me." The son is now cured.

The general failure of psychiatrists to appreciate God and his teachings on morality has resulted in great harm's being done. As an example, the Long Island Press carried the front page heading: "Sodomy Ring Smashed. Group charged with sexually abusing youths." The article said: "Four men-including an internationally known child psychiatrist . . . were arraigned yesterday on sodomy, sexual abuse and conspiracy charges involving adolescents."

While this may be an isolated case, the incidents of male psychiatrists having sexual relations with women patients are not. Thus one Christian woman went to a psychiatrist for help because of her frustration in her marital relations with her husband. He told her that she had three choices: Try to get her husband to see a psychiatrist; get a divorce; or have an extramarital affair with a "boyfriend," and he volunteered to serve as her "boyfriend."

Then there was the psychiatrist who was sued because, as reported in the New York Daily News: "He prescribed sexual relations with himself as therapy and then charged for the ‘treatments.'" Another psychiatrist was sued for $1,250,000 damages in the Supreme Court of the State of New York because he forced his patient to have sex relations with him under the guise of psychiatric treatment. In fact, one psychiatrist wrote a book recommending that psychiatrists be "sexually available to the patient, but not ‘insistent.'" He called the book The Love Treatment.

Two clinicians who run America's leading sex clinic said that a large proportion of eight hundred patients they treated admitted to having had sex relations with their psychiatrists or counselors. While some of these reports may be mere fantasies, wishful thinking or bragging, one of the doctors observed: "If only 25% of these specific reports are correct, there is still an overwhelming issue confronting professionals in this field."

Clearly, there is reason to exercise caution as regards worldly psychiatrists. For, while one may receive help, there is also a real possibility that one may be encouraged to pursue a course of conduct contrary to God's righteous principles. But even if that were not so, the failure of psychiatrists generally to know how properly to apply the best medicine for mental ills-the divine quality of love-is likely to render their treatment ineffectual.

Does this mean that there is nowhere that people can receive reliable psychotherapy in the sense of receiving help to see their problems through and solve them? Happily such help is available, and by means of it many persons have achieved mental health in this mixed-up world."---April 22, 1975 Awake! pp. 15-18

The problem with those quotations is that they are well over 40 and 50 years old.  Witnesses know that their beliefs change every 10-15 years so that is now irrelevant to them. 

The world in general has changed drastically in 20 years so most do not give much creedance to information from before 1980.

I agree with the others:  You are married to a jerk.  Just making a comment like that in front of both you and your/his child is callous.  The therapist should have caught on to that quickly.  Why not bring up your personal feelings about this statement in your next session. [NOTE:  suggest you leave the child at home.]

The societies views on psychiatry have somewhat mellowed but I think they still have some aversion to it.

In my own congregation, one of our elders was a psychologist.  Even so, I was counselled against 'self-help' books and education.

There is inconsistency, confusion and double-standards on this matter.

Good luck with the therapy.  Painful as it is, it might help you get on to a better life before spending more years going down a fraudulent path.  (Better to learn truths now than 22 years from now, isn't it??)

-Aude Sapere (Meaning: Dare to Know, etc...)

Mary I love you :)  Thank you! 

 I know I HEARD the admonition many times as a JW that if you are depressed you just need to go out in service more, go to meetings more, study more...that it is self induced and therefore self cured if you would just become a better JW!  I was surrounded by a sea of friends seeking homeopathic remedies for their head, muscle ache and blood disorders which they themselves diagnosed and "cured" using various combinations of NATURAL or organic pills and potions...to no avail. All the while telling me that psychiatrists were evil and because they were worldly would seek to convince the JW that their religion was the cause of their depression, and every JW worth their salt knows that Jehovahs People Are Happy People and so to be unhappy must inherently be a failure on their part.  And around and around they went until they lost their minds, souls, and marriages...completely. 

Perhaps this is one of those things that wasnt specifically put in writing so as to allow them deniability but was SAID a lot.  I wanted to show my counselor the kinds of things they write.

Thank you again!

WLD

Questions  (Watchtower 1996)

Would

Reports from some lands indicate that there has been an increase in emotional and mental illnesses in these "last days." (2 Timothy 3:1) Christians feel deep compassion when fellow believers are affected, but they recognize that each one must decide for himself whether to seek treatment for his illness and, if so, what kind of treatment. "Each one will carry his own load." (Galatians 6:5) Some, suffering severely from schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, deep clinical depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder, self-mutilation, and other distressing disorders, have been able to live fairly normal lives after obtaining the right professional help.

In some places it has become quite fashionable to seek therapy. In many cases the patient does not have a severe mental disorder but has difficulty coping with some situation in life. However, it is the Bible that gives the most effective help in handling the difficult problems of life. (Psalm 119:28, 143) Through the Bible, Jehovah supplies wisdom, thinking ability, and true knowledge—things that fortify us mentally and emotionally. (Proverbs 2:1-11; Hebrews 13:6) Faithful servants of God may express themselves irrationally at times because of severe inner turmoil. (Job 6:2, 3) James 5:13-16 encourages such ones to call on the elders for help and counsel. A Christian may be spiritually sick, or he may be distressed by an unchangeable circumstance or by oppressive stresses, or he may feel that he is the victim of injustice. (Ecclesiastes 7:7; Isaiah 32:2; 2 Corinthians 12:7-10) Such a person can find help with the elders, who will ‘grease him with oil’—that is, skillfully impart comforting Bible counsel—and also "pray over him." The result? "The prayer of faith will make the indisposed one well, and Jehovah will raise him up [out of his despondency or his feeling of being abandoned by God]."

What, though, if a person’s mental distress and confusion persist despite the skillful help of spiritual shepherds? Some in this situation have chosen to undergo a thorough physical examination. (Compare Proverbs 14:30; 16:24; 1 Corinthians 12:26.) A physical problem may lie behind emotional or mental distress. Treating such a problem has in some cases given relief to the emotionally ill person. If no physical problem is found, the physician, upon request, may recommend a mental-health professional. What then? As stated, this is a decision each individual must weigh for himself. Others should not criticize or judge.—Romans 14:4.

Nevertheless, practical wisdom must be exercised and care taken not to forget Bible principles. (Proverbs 3:21; Ecclesiastes 12:13) In the case of physical sickness, patients are faced with a variety of treatment choices, from orthodox medicine to therapies such as naturopathy, acupuncture, and homeopathy. There are also different kinds of mental-health practitioners. Among them are analytic psychotherapists and others, who may delve into the patient’s personal history to try to find reasons for irregular behavior or painful emotions. Behavioral psychotherapists may try to help the patient learn new behavior patterns. Some mental-health practitioners believe that most mental illnesses should be treated with drugs. Reportedly, others recommend diet and vitamins.

Patients and their families should use caution when considering these choices. (Proverbs 14:15) Significantly, Professor Paul McHugh, director of the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, said that the mental-health profession "is a rudimentary medical art. It lacks easy access to proof of its proposals even as it deals with disorders of the most complex features of human life—mind and behavior." This situation leaves the door open to eccentricity and fraud, as well as well-intentioned treatments that may do more harm than good.

It should be mentioned, too, that while psychiatrists and psychologists have professional, postgraduate degrees, many others with no professional qualifications practice without supervision as counselors or therapists. Some individuals have spent a lot of money consulting such unqualified people.

Even with a trained, qualified mental-health professional, there are things to consider. When choosing a medical doctor or surgeon, we have to be sure that he will respect our Bible-based views. Similarly, it would be dangerous to consult a mental-health professional who does not respect our religious and moral views. Many Christians are striving hard, despite mental and emotional confusion, to have "the same mental attitude that Christ Jesus had." (Romans 15:5) Such are rightly concerned about the attitudes of anyone who might affect their thinking or behavior. Some practitioners view any restrictions imposed by Scriptural beliefs as unnecessary and potentially harmful to mental health. They may approve, even recommend, practices condemned in the Bible, such as homosexuality or marital infidelity.

These ideas are included in what the apostle Paul called "the contradictions of the falsely called ‘knowledge.’" (1 Timothy 6:20) They contradict the truth about the Christ and are part of "the philosophy and empty deception" of this world. (Colossians 2:8) The Bible’s touchstone is clear: "There is no wisdom, nor any discernment, nor any counsel in opposition to Jehovah." (Proverbs 21:30) Mental-health practitioners who say "good is bad and bad is good" are "bad associations." Far from helping to heal unstable minds, they will "spoil useful habits."—Isaiah 5:20; 1 Corinthians 15:33.

So a Christian who feels that it is necessary to consult a mental-health professional should scrutinize the qualifications, attitude, and reputation of the practitioner and the possible effect of any treatment recommended. If a distressed Christian cannot do this himself, perhaps a mature, close friend or relative may be able to help. A Christian who is uncertain as to the wisdom of a particular treatment may find that talking with the elders in the congregation is helpful—although the final decision is his own (or his parents’, or the joint decision of husband and wife).

Science can do much more today than in times past to alleviate suffering. Still, there are many diseases—both physical and mental—that at present are incurable and have to be endured through this system of things. (James 5:11) In the meantime "the faithful and discreet slave," the elders, and all others in the congregation reach out a hand of compassion and support to sick ones. And Jehovah himself strengthens them to endure until that glorious time when sickness will be no more.—Matthew 24:45; Psalm 41:1-3; Isaiah 33:24.

[Footnotes]

Sometimes an individual may be asked to undergo a psychiatric evaluation, perhaps when being considered for high-level employment. Whether one submits to such an evaluation or not is a personal decision, but it should be noted that a psychiatric evaluation is not psychiatric treatment.

See "Winning the Battle Against Depression," in the March 1, 1990, issue of TheWatchtower.

Some mental illnesses seem to respond well to the correct medications. But these medications must be used with caution under the guidance of skilled and experienced medical physicians or psychiatrists, since there can be severe side effects if dosages are not correctly adjusted.

See the article "Mental Distress—When It Afflicts a Christian" in the October 15, 1988, issue of TheWatchtower.