Help Me Please !!!!!!!!


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    F Maddie posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:07:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 905 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    I need some support and advice with my situation and hope you don't mind me going on a bit because I feel wretched! I hurt so much with my JW family relationship and find it so frustrating that whatever I do or say doesn't make any difference.

    My son and wife had a little girl 9 months ago, my first and only grand child and I love her so much. When she was born my hubby and I helped them a lot wiith buying all the expensive things she needed, as my son hadn't a well paying job as being a die hard JW he believes in the "education and career isn't what you should be doing propaganda" put out buy the WT. We were delighted to do this and all I have asked is to see them and be a part of my grand daughter's life sometimes.

    I know I should be grateful that they let me see them at all, considering I told them about the UN involvement, failed prophecies, abuse cover-ups etc and they know I don't go to the KH any more. My husband thinks they treat me badly and that I let them blackmail me emotionally by not telling them off. So many times we have arranged with them to go over and see them and I get a text message at the last minute making some excuse why its not convenient for them. I get very upset as I am tonight and it keeps happening. He told me on the phone tonight that I can go over in two weeks time as they are busy until then and when I said I haven't seen them for 4 weeks already, he said I shouldn't measure time like that, whatever that means! If I tell him it upsets me not seeing them for long periods of time, he passes it off. After speaking to him I cry.

    How do you think I should handle it? All I want is to have a normal relationship with my son and grand daughter. My DIL controls the situation and I don't get a chance to see my son without her being around - she makes sure of it.

    Am I fighting a losing battle? I don't know what to do for the best any more.


    F myababes posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:14:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 61 of 66
    Joined 12/5/2007

    You poor thing my heart really goes out to you, to not see my beautiful grandaughter would break my heart so can imagine what you are going through.

    Perhaps you could write him a letter adressed personally to him but get someone else to write on the address so neither of them can reconise our writing. he will have opened it and then realise it was from you without her getting to it first.

    Then pour out your heart o him re the way you feel. Back off with all the untruths you have discovered for the moment let sleeping dogs lie for a while just concentrate on rebuilding bridges with him after all a mothers love is not easily dismissed.

    F west123 posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:21:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 15 of 23
    Joined 1/31/2008

    I am so sorry about your situation...Just losing my mother to cancer I hate it when I hear stories such as this. If I could move time back I would spend every second with my mother because right now I feel like it was not nearly enough, even though I saw her everyday..

    Maybe you could focus on all the sacrifices you have made for him in your life..let him know that you did these things because you love him and that will never ever change. I wish somehow he could realize but it seems that you never realize how much someone means to you until they are not there...its an awful catch-22.

    I wish you luck..I think the idea of writing him a letter is a good one, letters are captive audiences as the person must read the whole thing without a rebuttal..just try to reinforce the idea that you sacrificed so much for him, you deserve to still be very active in his and your granddaughters life.

    Also, have you tried talking to your DIL?? or will she have no part of it? Just wondering because maybe there is something you could reconcile with her without your son around, understand where she is coming from better..just a suggestion.

    sinis posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:28:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 712 of 1846
    Joined 5/24/2005

    You may want to tell him that once you are gone, your gone. No getting that person back. He will probably quote the Bible and JW bullshit on the paradise, but I would remind him that a "bird in hand is better than two in the bush". Live life now, for tomorrow we not know what it brings...

    You may also want to just stop by. Don't call, just say you were in the neighborhood. Eventually, though, I would flat out ask them - face to face - why he is "shitting" on you, and keeping you away. After, all did you not bring him into this world, wipe his ass, and raise him, to what he has grown up to today? I would stress that you would like a little appreciation and seeing your grand child is not too much to ask.

    Sounds like his wife is a jealous bitch!!!! No doubt she is trying to control him - such actions only split families. I would also ask your son if they go to her parents house on a regular basis - I bet they do.

    As mentioned, remind your son that when you pass this world, he will no longer have the opportunity to change anything. I know what that feels like considering my grandfather was DF'd when I was 12 yo. My stepmother would not allow us kids to see him, and I never spoke to him or saw him until he was on his death bed some 7 years later. I curse the WTS to this day for taking away what matters in life, which is family...

    F Maddie posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:33:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 906 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    If I could move time back I would spend every second with my mother because right now I feel like it was not nearly enough, even though I saw her everyday..

    west123 - I am so sorry you lost your mother like that. I know because I lost mine when I was aged 15 years old and I have never stopped missing her either. I think it makes it worse for me with my son because he doesn't want me and it really upsets me because I love him so much.

    myababes - Yes I could try writing to him to express everything I feel and hope he has some compassion in his heart that hasn't been affected by being a JW.


    sinis posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:37:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 713 of 1846
    Joined 5/24/2005

    I would not waste your time writing - confront him face to face and point blank ask him. Do not give him the opportunity to white wash the situation. Confronting him will give you a more honest, straight forth answer.

    Plummet posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:40:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 132 of 167
    Joined 10/13/2005

    Have you tried meeting him for lunch at his work? Your daughter In-law would not be around to control him then. A heart to heart talk always has more value when spoken in person then when writen.

    F Maddie posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:47:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 907 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    Sounds like his wife is a jealous bitch!!!! No doubt she is trying to control him - such actions only split families. I would also ask your son if they go to her parents house on a regular basis - I bet they do.

    sinis - I think you are right about my son's wife, she just wants to keep them to herself. I have always sensed this and seen evidence of her being controlling. As far as her family is concerned, they are not JW's and she isn't close to them. It seems from what she has said that she doesn't regard them as very important in her life.


    F Casper posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:48:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 282 of 1758
    Joined 4/6/2001


    My Heart goes out to you.... what a terrible way for a new Grandmother to be treated...I have two grand children and couldn't handle being put off like that.

    You may also want to just stop by. Don't call, just say you were in the neighborhood. Eventually, though, I would flat out ask them - face to face - why

    I totally agree with the above.........I know, for me.........That is what I would do...



    F AudeSapere posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:53:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 2027 of 4483
    Joined 2/2/2006

    Babies change so much that in 4 weeks she'll be almost a different person. And 9 months is such a fun age!!

    Would they allow you to babysit her so they can go to dinner?

    I wouldn't give up on your son. I think it's Garybuss who says to think of JW's as having a form of mental retardation and treat them as such.

    I'm sorry you have this heartbreaking situation in your life. I do understand the pain. Most of us do.


    SPAZnik posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:56:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 2279 of 2889
    Joined 4/1/2002

    A few ideas for you to take, leave or shake your head at:

    You can tell your son straight up that you would appreciate a healthier relationship from his end. Keep it real simple and honest and non-judgemental.

    You can do the same with your DIL.

    You could also cater to (soothe) the (childish) fears of the woman who has your son by the you know whats. Control is often a sign of fear. Probably she needs to be reassured over and over and over and in as many ways as is reasonably possible until she gets the freaking message that you respect her "position" in your son's life, as mother of your grandchild. Build a relationship with her until she finally feels safe and secure with you. Become an asset to her. Treat her like the daughter you need to get to know until she no longer reacts jealously of any time you spend with your son. (I know it seems ridiculous, but that's just how it is with some insecure people, I'm not sure if your DIL is being insecure or just insensitive or a bit of both.) The more you empower her, honestly and unselfishly, the more likely she will learn to respect and appreciate you.

    You could also back off and wait until they come to you. This may involve grieving the potential loss of the "normal" relationship illusion you are clinging to.

    The next time they want you to be available for them, don't be. Perhaps they will begin respecting your time more when you demonstrate that the "I'm not available" thing is a two-way street and you are not their doormat, nor will you allow them to take advantage of you forever.

    Also, stop paying for things. There's nothing less healthy than a relationship that is, in any way shape or form, bought.

    You could also let them see you cry. This emotional HONESTY might reach their otherwise icy hearts and give them a glimpse of awareness about the real effects of their behaviours and choices.

    Your feelings matter too, grandmama. Stop trying to protect them from the real effects of their decisions. When you do this, you are LYING to them.

    Above all else, do what you would do and say what you would say if you knew that you had only a week left to live and there was no more time for bs beating around the bush.

    I hope your kid(s) come to appreciate you more.


    ps - one more thought ... you could also put your energies into being ready for when your grandchild grows up and has a mind and heart of it's own to decide about a relationship with you. send your unselfish love in little ways and means possible regardless of who tries to stand in the way and trust that they can and very likely will always love you back and better days will eventually come.

    F AudeSapere posted Tue, 18 Mar 2008 23:58:00 GMT(3/18/2008)

    Post 2028 of 4483
    Joined 2/2/2006

    Oh! Can you just make a deal with them? No WT talk at all. They don't talk 'pro' and you don't talk 'con'??

    Maybe a truce is in order. Respect their decision to stay in the org and promise to not try to coerce the granddaughter to the 'darkside'.

    Just call them out on what you hope for and help them see how this is good for everyone. Could be an option????


    M nomoreguilt posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:05:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 804 of 1304
    Joined 11/22/2007

    Maddie......The deepest wounds are inflicted on us by the ones we love the most. In considering CoCo's post the other day of Empty Nester Dads, I have been stewing on a matter very similar to yours. You know how we are, like you I have been deeply hurt by my son and his wife over MY grand son. Time works many things out, but in the meanwhile, time is slipping us by, isn't it?

    We aren't getting any younger, and the grand children are getting older. We lose precious moments that could have been shared with us in their early developmental months and years. Believe me dear, I have shed many tears on this same subject. It has cut me to the heart that my own offspring, my flesh and blood could treat me the way they do.

    Yes, your DIL is influencing your son very much. Perhaps he is afraid of losing his wife for his mother. It's very deep shit that goes on in his mind, I KNOW!! Young parents, young wife, JW IDEALISTIC lifestyle. We dn't exist in their lives anymore. Just a passing thought or a phone call to say hi is all I get. Or to tell me so-and-so passed away.

    Read the thread by CoCo the other day, it's in Private Discussion.

    Take care dear.I will post an in depth thread on this tomorrow, i hope. Watch for it.


    Hortensia posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:07:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 3453 of 7617
    Joined 12/9/2006

    I agree, don't pay for things. Tell your son he shouldn't measure your affection that way. Be honest about how you feel, and then tell him you aren't going to accept the role of bad guy because of the JWs, that you don't accept their religion as true. You respect his right to believe if he wants to, but he needs to respect your right not to believe and let Jehovah decide it all in the end. Then, painful as it will be, let it all go. I am so sorry you are the victim of these mind games, and your little granddaughter is the loser also.

    F Maddie posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:10:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 908 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    Maybe a truce is in order. Respect their decision to stay in the org and promise to not try to coerce the granddaughter to the 'darkside'.

    Aude - I have already said this to them and it hasn't made any difference. I will never give up because I can never accept it to let go enough

    Stop trying to protect them from the real effects of their decisions.

    Spaz - This is what my husband thinks and it will have to come to this I expect. I have tried to hide my feelings to a large degree because ..... It is very hard to try to get close to my DIL because she is very reticent and I can't get to spend enough time with her to work on her's very frustrating for me. I will try.

    Casper - You understand how it is for me, thank you for sharing with me


    SPAZnik posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:12:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 2280 of 2889
    Joined 4/1/2002
    I don't know what to do for the best any more.

    This would be a really humble comment to share with your son. Perhaps it would open some eyes and doors.

    sspo posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:21:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 1446 of 2352
    Joined 6/25/2006

    As long he fully believes in the watchtower and how to treat those that don't attend or sound apostate i feel it is a losing battle.

    My ex wife has left me due to "spiritual endangerment" even though i'm not DF and never gave her any problem in serving her Jehovah, she has not talked to her mother in 14 years because she faded from the organization.

    Don't have an answer but your son is under mind control and the loyalty will be always for the watchtower......unless he wakes up one day.

    Take care of yourself for now because reasoning with him will not work.

    F Maddie posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:23:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 909 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    We don't exist in their lives any more

    NMG - I am truly sorry you are going through this too - it is killing me!

    I am so sorry you are the victim of these mind games, and your little granddaughter is the loser also.

    Hortensia - I am sick of the mind games, sick of all of it. All I want is to be able to love my son and grand daughter but it seems they don't want me. I need to be strong but don't feel very strong right now. Thank you for your advice, you are always wise.


    F Maddie posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:31:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 910 of 1027
    Joined 8/29/2007

    I won't be posting any more tonight as it's 12.30 am here and I feel very weary. I will come back tomorrow so good night my friends.


    F Deidra posted Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:44:00 GMT(3/19/2008)

    Post 25 of 54
    Joined 10/25/2007

    Maddie, my heart feels your pain too. I went through the wishy washy thing with my parents/family for years. One minute they loved me and I was a great daughter and then another minute they wouldn't even talk to me (usually on Sunday or after a circuit/district convention). They were warm and cold. Their love was conditional. The farther I got away from JW and the more outspoken I became for my newfound christian beliefs, the worse they got. I got tired of "feeling them out." The status of our relationship was up to them at all times. I got damn sick of it. I feel so much better now that I took the driver's seat and said enough is enough. It is no longer up to them rather we engage in conversation, etc. I want nothing to do with them. The roller coaster pain is over with them. Yes, it does hurt that I don't have any family. However, I feel free from their enslavement, judgement, and mental abuse. It hurts, but it's consistent hurt; no more mind games. It may sound harsh, dear, but you need to protect yourself and start healing. They are going to dangle that little girl in front of you forever until you give in to their strong-arming. For you and your husband's sake, don't let them mentally abuse you anymore.


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