Help on: GB comparing themselves to Moses, Jesus, Prophets

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    DesirousOfChange posted Mon, 19 Mar 2012 19:39:00 GMT(3/19/2012)

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    I've had a discussion with a friend concerning the GB or Org being "inspired" or "spirit-directed" or a "prophet". I found the great strings about claiming prophet status (particularly 04/01/1972 WT and 10/01/1982 WTs).

    It seems I recall a WT or other publication where they compared themselves to Moses, or even Jesus as the ONE channel being used by Jehovah.

    While I don't recall any claim of "inspiration", there are dozens using "spirit-directed organization".

    Interestingly, note the reference to Jesus:

    *** w03 5/15 p. 15 Listen to What the Spirit Says! ***
    Listen to What the Spirit Says!
    “Let the one who has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregations.”—REVELATION 3:22.
    JEHOVAH’S servants must pay attention to the spirit-directed words of Jesus Christ . . . . .

    That kinda puts them claiming to be right up there with Jesus, doesn't it!

    Thanks for any references you can offer.

    Doc

    00DAD posted Mon, 19 Mar 2012 19:51:00 GMT(3/19/2012)

    Post 1907 of 5183
    Joined 7/29/2011

    Let's review, no references needed as the following are all common knowledge facts. According to the Bible, we know these are God's Anointed Leaders because of the visible proof:

    • Moses had the 10 Plagues and the Parting of the Red Sea
    • Jesus had a bunch of miracles:
      • Turning Water to Wine (good stuff too)
      • Walking on Water
      • Raising a couple of dead people
      • Curing the sick and infirm
      • etc. ...
    • The WTB&TS has ...... nothing! No I take that back. Their miracle is that people continue to follow them IN SPITE OF the fact that nothing they predict ever comes true!

    mP posted Mon, 19 Mar 2012 21:51:00 GMT(3/19/2012)

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    Its much harder to fake miracles today unlike in Jesus time. There are videos about Hero of Alexandria made "miracle" machines including one which took water and poured out wine. The ones i have seen are quite interesting as going to the temple was part magic show, part spiritual experience.

    00DAD posted Mon, 19 Mar 2012 22:03:00 GMT(3/19/2012)

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    mP, when we watch movies we all indulge in a certain amount of "suspension of disbelief" to fully get into the movie. Good movies, or any good fiction for that matter, maintain a certain amount of consistency within the framework of the story no matter how fantastic or unrealistic the premise is.

    Without getting into any theological arguments about whether or not Jesus existed and whether or not he actually performed any miracles we can easily point out that EVEN WITHIN THE FRAMEWORK OF WT THEOLOGY they have nothing to prove their divine backing.

    That's why everything happens "invisibly" and they rely on the "miracles will cease" excuse.

    Basically, they got nothin'!

    metatron posted Mon, 19 Mar 2012 23:11:00 GMT(3/19/2012)

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    I don't have a Bible right at hand but I recall that Numbers puts the lie to these idiotic self exaltation statements. The Israelites were rebelling again, against Moses and for Miriam or somebody else. Jehovah said, 'I talk to Moses face to face and not by dreams or visions - which I would use if I raised up a prophet from among you' - telling them that whatever they came up with was second class, at best.

    So, the modern "Anointed" don't even get that far. No inspired prophecies, no dreams, no visions, just rehash interpretations of the Bible. An inferior means of communication, relative to Moses, no matter what they say.

    metatron

    mP posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:16:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    00DAD

    My comments were just about turning water into wine, were just to show that some priests in Egypt had been doing the trick for hundreds of years before Jesus came along. No doubt those stories were known by some if not many throughout the ancient world, thus the need for Jesus to show he was just as powerful or cool. After all if the priests in Alexandria could turn wate rinto wine, and jesus couldnt that would be a big disappiontment. We also see the same copy cat principal in Matthew with his Mary was a virgin impregnated by God story, which of cours eis a common theme in the ancient world. In the OT we have the same miracle births in Samson, Issac, Moses etc.

    mind blown posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 08:22:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    What I find silly, how can the GB say they're spirit-directed or even anointed, if their personl interpetation or prophacies through the WT aren't spirit inspired?

    Watchtower: 23. March 1, 1979. "the “faithful and discreet slave” has alerted all of God’s people to the sign of the times indicating the nearness of God’s Kingdom rule. In this regard, however, it must be observed that this “faithful and discreet slave” was never inspired, never perfect. Those writings by certain members of the “slave” class that came to form the Christian part of God’s Word were inspired and infallible [the bible], but that is not true of other writings since."

    The Governing Body are Squatters, by imagined rights of 1914. I also love how they have the nerve to call themselves "The Glorious Ones"

    mind blown posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 09:31:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Ps

    The above WT statment was to due to the 1975 end times shenanigans. However, what they did by trying to spin an excuse, they lost their theocratic cred (as far as I'm cocerned) by admitting they are NOT inspired, only the bible (gods word) is inspired.

    mP posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 09:52:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    @mindblown

    this is a serious question, in what way is the bible inspired ?

    honesty, justice, historicity ?

    TimothyT posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 10:34:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    When you look at the NT you can see clearly that Jesus came to sum up the prophets. He was the last one that Jehovah would send and after his sacrifice he became the ultimate saviour for mankind. Because of his sacrifice, we no longer need another prophet as its through Jesus name alone we are saved. If anyone teaches more than this then they are false prophets.

    1 Timothy 2:5 tells us plainly: For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus.

    The governing body have conveniently inserted themselves into that equation, are subverting the authority of Jesus, and are thus apostates. Simple!

    Tim x

    designs posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 10:47:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Timothy,

    This is just a repeat of Vicarious Christi speaking ex-cathedra. This position gets a personal flavor added to it by various christian denominations and christian persuasions ie Born Againers or those claiming to be Slain in the Spirit.

    DesirousOfChange posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 12:45:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Thanks for the replies.

    What I was searching for was an article that listed the persons or groups that God used throughout history -- Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus -- and then the WTS added themselves to this exclusive list.

    Thanks to anyone if that rings a bell.

    Trying to seach WT-Library for those words is just too broad.

    Doc

    M thetrueone posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 13:14:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    The WTS. has been inspired to lie as a self supporting means of empowerment and to sell its literature to the public.

    The WTS. leaders have done what many other religions have done and that is to self proclaim that they are spirit directed by god.

    Self proclaiming themselves in this way helps to lure people to their organization as well toward establishing a sense of viability.

    Lying is a valuable asset to all religions, without it most probably wouldn't exist.

    blond-moment posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 13:56:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    They do compare themselves to Jesus, even wrote themselves into this prophecy as equal to Jesus.

    June 15, 2012 page 8 Par 4 (study edition - you just won't find this kind of craziness in the public edition)

    "Soon after the rebellion in Eden, Jehovah made a promise that a "woman" would produce a "seed." (Read Genesis 3:15.) That seed would eventually bruise the serpent, Satan, in the head. Jehovah later revealed that the seed would come through Abraham, belong to the nation?of Israel, be a Judean, and be a descendant of King David. (Gen. 22:15-18; 49:10; Ps. 89:3, 4; Luke 1:30-33) The principal part of that seed proved to be Christ Jesus. (Gal. 3:16) The secondary part of the seed is made up of the spirit anointed members of the Christian congregation. (Gal. 3:26-29) Jesus and these anointed ones unite to form God's Kingdom, the instrument with which God will crush Satan.—Luke 12:32; Rom. 16:20."

    Amelia Ashton posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 14:00:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    Principal seed and secondary seed. Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo

    mind blown posted Tue, 20 Mar 2012 17:20:00 GMT(3/20/2012)

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    @mP If you read my post carefully, you'll see I was qouting from the WT article above, not agreeing with it.

    mP posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 06:14:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

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    MindBlown:

    I was adding the question for emphasis, and simply because you did not include your own opinion.

    mind blown posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:39:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

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    I included my own opinion to DOF's question above my first post. This is DOF's thread, if you'd like to start a new thread re your interests and questions (proving the bible un-inspired) which doesn't seem related to this thread, it is proper to do so.

    mind blown posted Wed, 21 Mar 2012 17:23:00 GMT(3/21/2012)

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    @DOF not sure if this is what you needed:

    "For an answer, people should listen to the plain preaching by the remnant prefigured by Jeremiah, for these preach to men the present-day fulfillment of Jeremiah's prophecies. Who made them a prophet to speak with the authority that they claim? Well, who made Jeremiah a prophet?" Watchtower 1959 Jan15 pp.39-41

    *******************************

    "So, does Jehovah have a prophet to help them, to warn them of dangers and to declare things to come?

    IDENTIFYING THE "PROPHET"
    These questions can be answered in the affirmative. Who is this prophet? ... This "prophet" was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah's Christian witnesses. ... Of course, it is easy to say that this group acts as a "prophet" of God. It is another thing to prove it. The only way that this can be done is to review the record. Thus this group of anointed followers of Jesus Christ, doing a work in Christendom paralleling Ezekiel's work among the Jews, were manifestly the modern-day Ezekiel, the "prophet" commissioned by Jehovah to declare the good news of God's Messianic kingdom and to give warning to Christendom."Watchtower 1972 Apr 1 pp.197-199 '

    *******************************

    Narcissistic Supply posted Fri, 02 Aug 2013 18:23:11 GMT(8/2/2013)

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    Moving My Bowels To the Outer Limits Of Logic and Linear Thinking to bring you the latest delusions of grandeur brought forth by the Governing Body Of The Jehovah’s Witnesses.

    When I say that the governing body is pathologically delusional i mean that in the nicest way. They mean to infect others with their mental illness and delusions of grandeur. It’s all about the ego of the governing body and propagating their delusions upon the 7 million Jehovah’s witness crazy train. It’s not easy to fool 7 Million people but somehow they have managed this and kept the racket going for 100 years. Now that’s pretty amazing if you ask me considering the math of 7 million people via ing for a spot on the 144,000 crazy train. Do the math and it comes out to 1 in 10,000 jehovah’s witnesses getting on the crazy train out of the 7 billion world population. And the chances are getting smaller every day that the population grows.

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